scambo1

I don't know why there is a debate. I really don't. Why would you debate whether the sky was blue.

As a results oriented personality type, I can point to some ALPA positive results. I can also point to the short list you have written and add to it citing negatives. Is there ever going to be a national SOS for any reason? Never.

In the end, ALPA's lifecycle has IMO run its course. Now we have, as many would point out, an unresponsive "bloated" bureaucracy that is only self serving. I agree with this assesment.

What we Delta Pilots need is a union that is entirely serving the Delta Pilots.

OccupyRestSeat

Sent it in over a year ago & actively recruiting.

I just don't understand why folks want to continue sending their hard-earned money to a bloated, corrupt, and obsolete organization that doesn't give a rat's hairy behind about our best interests--only in propagating the bureaucracy and riding the gravy train.

And why is DALPA perpetually and aggressively attempting to lower my expectations on this next contract?

ATLPilot

Actually just had this conversation with a buddy who told me that if you look through the ALPA life and disability insurances they only cover you if you are with ALPA. He said that Harvey Watt insurance was less expensive for him and the old lady by a good bit for the same stuff and it didn't matter who he flew for so.....

LeineLodge

Scambo,

I agree with much of what you write, but would like to make a point of clarification. There is a large difference between the "bloated" national bureaucracy and the Delta pilots who do most of the work (mostly on the committee side of things.)

I would only point to the last 3 LOA's, which have all secured some pretty significant contractual gains outside of Section 6, to show that the guys in the trenches are not all self-serving. Are there exceptions? Sure, but it's a pretty wide brush to paint all ALPA folks as "self-serving."

I agree that many things are broken and need fixing. Unfortunately, I think the time for that has passed until we get through this next contract. We need a unified group (regardless of who our bargaining agent is) if we're going to achieve what most of us want in C2012.

At the end of the day, we're all Delta pilots and I want to take whatever course will get the most guys the most of what they want.

In the interest of full disclosure, I am not staunchly ALPA or pro-DPA. I did send in my card over a year ago, but will not likely renew it going into Section 6 unless something REALLY egregious happens within ALPA. Like it or not, ALPA is going to be negotiating this next contract and if we want results, we have to support the process as it is, not as we would like it to be.

Just my two cents

scambo1

Leine;

To be clear ALPA is national, DALPA is Delta. I am not slamming the DALPA folks. I'd like to de-couple from national.

LeineLodge

You know, I re-read your post after I quoted you and I realized that I might have mis-interpreted. RTFQ I guess, right?

I agree with you, but just don't see it happening before we get into negotiations.

Wasatch Phantom

Leine,

I appreciate your honesty and sincerity. I too want the best contract possible, but for me ALPA's performance from letter 46 to the present has been simply abysmal.

There is an phrase in the south that I really like. It goes like this: "Sir, I'd like the opportunity to earn your business..."

ALPA has failed on multiple occasions. Their performance has not "earned my business", but rather I would like to fire them and hire DPA.

As a "Dead Zoner" I can't afford another mediocre effort on the part of ALPA and I don't want to give them yet another opportunity to fail.

ACL and others write passionately (and somewhat persuasively) about "change from within" but whatever progress (if any) is waay too slow. Just look at how long it's taking to get the flight pay loss data made public. That's absolutely pathetic and indefensible.

ALPA has run out of "second chances".

DAL73n

I have yet to meet a DALPA rep who isn't hard working and dedicated to making things better. Our Pilot group is pretty experienced since everyone has at least 10 years on property except for the most recent 500 from the 2007 hire group. I remember being dumped into Section 6 and a strike vote with just 6 mos. on property - pretty overwhelming. The vast majority of LEC reps (and other volunteers) are working hard to make things better but somehow we have a lack of confidence in our MEC (I'm wary about some of the things are being put out). I hopeful that the constructive engagement carries over to Section 6 - would love to see significant improvements (yes - I did my survey) by the amendable date - that would be awesome to see it go into effect Jan 1, 2013.

Pineapple Guy

You don't think bankruptcy just might have had a bit to do with it, do you?

Carl Spackler

Bankruptcy has nothing to do with writing scope language that is so weak, the ALPA lawyers that wrote it say they can't possibly defend it. Bankruptcy has nothing to do with the fact that our union mischaracterizes the SWAPA contract instead of using it as the massive leverage tool that it is. Bankruptcy has nothing to do with refusing to add Air France to our contract comparison after promising they would prior to the survey closing. What's worse is their excuse of not being able to release the Air France data due to privacy reasons...despite my finding it on Google in 3 seconds.

These are just a FEW of the things that have me scared of ALPA running this Section 6 for us.

Carl