Delta Pilots Association
02-27-2011, 02:16 PM
#4533
No longer cares
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 767er Captain
Posts: 12,109
The discussion was what should our national be doing on our behalf and why should we support ALPA-PAC.
I don't see any reason to support ALPA-PAC since ALPA can use money to educate the lawmakers on whatever they seem to think is important because based on what I've seen most didn't want age 65 yet ALPA was behind it etc.
ALPA-PAC just wants to buy votes and based on the list of folks they gave to last election cycle http://www.alpa.org/portals/alpa/dep...ts_1-14-11.pdf I don't want to give money to them.
I don't see any reason to support ALPA-PAC since ALPA can use money to educate the lawmakers on whatever they seem to think is important because based on what I've seen most didn't want age 65 yet ALPA was behind it etc.
ALPA-PAC just wants to buy votes and based on the list of folks they gave to last election cycle http://www.alpa.org/portals/alpa/dep...ts_1-14-11.pdf I don't want to give money to them.
02-27-2011, 02:44 PM
#4534
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,049
Can we join SWAPA? I love their scope section:
A. SCOPE
This Agreement is made and entered into between Southwest Airlines Co. (hereinafter known as the "Company") and the Southwest Airlines Pilots' Association (hereinafter known as the "Association"). This Agreement covers all revenue and miscellaneous flying, performed with aircraft owned or leased by the Company, or which displays Company markings, including all flying in and for the service of the Company and its affiliates. All flying covered by this Agreement shall be performed by pilots whose names appear on the Southwest Airlines Master Pilot Seniority List, except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement.
The purpose of this Agreement, in the mutual interest of the Company and the Association, is to provide for the operation of the Company under methods which will further, to the fullest extent possible, the safety of air transportation, the efficiency of operation and the continuation of employment of all pilots under safe and reasonable working conditions and proper compensation. It is recognized to be the duty of the Company, the Association and the employees to cooperate fully, reasonably, and in good faith for the attainment of these purposes.
This Agreement is made and entered into between Southwest Airlines Co. (hereinafter known as the "Company") and the Southwest Airlines Pilots' Association (hereinafter known as the "Association"). This Agreement covers all revenue and miscellaneous flying, performed with aircraft owned or leased by the Company, or which displays Company markings, including all flying in and for the service of the Company and its affiliates. All flying covered by this Agreement shall be performed by pilots whose names appear on the Southwest Airlines Master Pilot Seniority List, except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement.
The purpose of this Agreement, in the mutual interest of the Company and the Association, is to provide for the operation of the Company under methods which will further, to the fullest extent possible, the safety of air transportation, the efficiency of operation and the continuation of employment of all pilots under safe and reasonable working conditions and proper compensation. It is recognized to be the duty of the Company, the Association and the employees to cooperate fully, reasonably, and in good faith for the attainment of these purposes.
02-27-2011, 03:33 PM
#4535
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,716
What about the statement: All flying covered by this Agreement shall be performed by pilots whose names appear on the Southwest Airlines Master Pilot Seniority List, except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement.
The except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement....what else is provided for?
The except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement....what else is provided for?
02-27-2011, 03:40 PM
#4536
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 19,704
It does not really matter what else is in the agreement. SWAPA did not really have to negotiate for anything since the companies business plan did not want or require RJ's. You don't need feed in a point to point operation. That may well change in the next 10 years as the SW operations shifts however even today it is for the most part point to point.
02-27-2011, 04:16 PM
#4537
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2010
Position: window seat
Posts: 12,544
Didn't AT sign deals for RJ outsourced lift prior to the merger though? What happens to them? And didn't the AT TA agree to 84 seat jet outsourcing?
To not keep an eye on this simply because of some concept of "corporate culture" or business model is ill advised.
To not keep an eye on this simply because of some concept of "corporate culture" or business model is ill advised.
02-27-2011, 05:14 PM
#4538
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,049
It does not really matter what else is in the agreement. SWAPA did not really have to negotiate for anything since the companies business plan did not want or require RJ's. You don't need feed in a point to point operation. That may well change in the next 10 years as the SW operations shifts however even today it is for the most part point to point.
PHX - 40.3%
DEN - 35%
BWI - 39%
HOU - 35%
LAS - 34%
Interestingly, I took your premise and ran it through my little data engine. Turns out Northwest and Delta had a greater difference between O&D v/s flow passengers than Delta and SWA do. This is probably as a result of Delta and SWA having hubs in stronger O&D markets than NWA did. Passenger flows do not rationalize our scope. The common denominator in DAL & NWA scope is ALPA.
Southwest IS more efficient at pilot staffing because they are not having to flow NINE different pilot seniority lists across their domestic route network. That efficiency translates into dollars for their pilots. They are well represented by NOT outsourcing their work.
Come on Sailing, the numbers bear me out. Get on board, get Tim on board. Lets turn this thing around.
Last edited by Bucking Bar; 02-27-2011 at 05:46 PM.
02-27-2011, 05:15 PM
#4539
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,049
02-27-2011, 05:17 PM
#4540
Can't abide NAI
Joined APC: Jun 2007
Position: Douglas Aerospace post production Flight Test & Work Around Engineering bulletin dissembler
Posts: 12,049
What about the statement: All flying covered by this Agreement shall be performed by pilots whose names appear on the Southwest Airlines Master Pilot Seniority List, except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement.
The except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement....what else is provided for?
The except as otherwise provided for in this Agreement....what else is provided for?
Those two paragraphs I posted are the entire scope section.
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