slowplay

Do a search and you'll see he used adjusted rates for the years before the 88 delivery. We don't have a pre-merger fleet type that spanned 1978-2010.

shiznit

OK. 600mil in savings plus about 1-2 bil in profit.....

Still should mean NO PROBLEM meeting our restoration goals (in rates/retirement anyway).

Anyone know how to cost out the value of C2K era work rules?

The CA's I fly with tell stories of the "bow wave" and the "high yellow". I want a piece of that action!

(I also want the FDX vacation system!)
PREPARE FOR INCOMING!!!! You are going to be accused of "managing expectations".

I can't tell from the context whether you are trying to manage expectations or just hoping Corp. has a solid "emergency fund" built up so they don't come running to the pilots to bail them out so we keep the gains/restoration that happen in C12K.

sailingfun

The company has had 3 quarters of profit. Look at the history of this industry. If you really think we are going to sustain that profit I have several bridges to sell you. The profit we are making right now is because of huge capacity restraint in the industry. It wont last. All the CEO's are watching each other like hawks waiting for the first one to make a market share grab and then all the profits will be gone in 12 months.
In addition Delta has the elephant in the closet with the worst customer service. We either make huge improvements in customer service or this airline will be back in Chapter 11 in 5 years. My suggestion would be to tie all management bonus directly to our customer service rankings by the 3 biggest evaluation services. Perhaps they would actually get serious about taking care of the customer.

Pineapple Guy

When I posted this the first time, I laid out all the disclaimers. I used B727 rates for the first few years as a proxy for the M88. They are also obviously inflation adjusted numbers. I got the actual rates from all our old DAL contracts.

tsquare

dalpa should have those numbers at their fingertips. I would be surprised if they didn't... check that... at any rate.. if they published the difference between 10,000 pilots at C2K versus 12,000 pilots post BK... your eyes will water and there would be a riot. I'll betcha it isn't 25 cents on the dollar.

tsquare

You know.. all of what you say is true, but why should labor continually have to pass the hat in order to save the company? Next time we have a contract.. it better be a damn expensive one, and it will be management's problem as to how to fund it.

gloopy

But as scope decreases, you get less of everything. Scope is the one true area where as it is relaxed the pie really does shrink. The more flying you outsource the less leverage you have to seek gains anywhere else, with one exception. That exception is immediately and temporarily after granting scope relief, you can for a brief period, get paid a little extra initially. Soon after though, that extra raise is gone and then some. Selling scope is like a payday loan. You walk out of the place with a fist full of hundred dollar bills, but when the gravity of the 30% weekly interest hits you, you're on the back side of the power curve real quick.

TheManager

I do like your suggestion about tying in all management bonuses directly to customer satisfaction. (Experience our trans oceanic service lately?) I'd add one as well. Employee satisfaction. You'll never get customer satisfaction unless one attains employee satisfaction as well. Examples: Post Lorenzo Continental, Southwest.

Now, for the rest of your post. We all know that the airline business is highly cyclical. Given. However, over the last couple of years they have had better success in riding the cycle. Capacity discipline. Fuel surcharges. Bag fees. A la cart fees.

So, when the media, management and DALPA/ALPA hit the panic button when the next downturn in the econmy comes, why should we be anything other than a fixed cost like fuel, leases, landing fees, catering, parts, etc.? Why should we allow ourselves to be the low hanging fruit, the ATM machine for management?

That being said, we understand 1113 was completely different. They had significant leverage and used it. We are talking about the typical up and down economy here.

TheManager

Ok. Sorry you felt so insulted . Can't change how you see it although that is a personal perception on your part.

However, I am going with your logic is flawed, fatally. Your math is also flawed but primarily due to the flaw in your logic.

Being that it is Wildcard Saturday, I will address this flaw a little later. Proper clock management is inorder here.

Reroute

You'd think DPA would put out the numbers, but then again DPA isn't known for its transparency. Anyone read their C&BLs, or seen some financial disclosure, or who they've retained for representation, or legal council, or negtiations, or anything?