Delta Pilots Association
12-10-2010, 06:43 AM
#3492
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Position: 777 Sim Instructor
Posts: 745
Satch, I am way senior and I would strike in a heartbeat over any scope sales,period. I might differ a little with a lot of people on here in that I think trying to buy back scope presents some problems and is a double edged sword. A large part of the problem will go away on its own with higher fuel prices and crowded airports. It will be interesting to see what the new UAL does in this regard because that will give us a good idea on the future lay of the land.
Keep posting, if everybody on here agreed on different items these threads would have died long ago.
Keep posting, if everybody on here agreed on different items these threads would have died long ago.
12-10-2010, 07:30 AM
#3493
Happy to be here
Joined APC: Jun 2006
Position: A-320A
Posts: 18,563
I agree with Finis.
It is actually good to have your position on here. If anything, the response should make you realize that the senior guys get scope too. Talk to the guys you fly with. I have had the occasional one that is willing to sell anything for his alimony payment, but the fact is that most realize after the last decade that scope thus far has been permanent and pay has been temporary.
Everyone would "like" the buying power of C2k, no doubt about it, but the majority of pilots at Delta are willing to wait and see what the conditions dictate. Margins in the upper single digits to lower double digits combined with what APA and UALALPA do will play in to that.
As for what we buy back or do not buy back. Scope is unity. Simple as that. Bring the flying back in house and you can command the pay rates that may expect because you corner the market on Delta flying. We as a pilot group need to answer "yes" to the "IF" before we worry about the "how."
The how has may options but it takes resolve for the "if"
It is actually good to have your position on here. If anything, the response should make you realize that the senior guys get scope too. Talk to the guys you fly with. I have had the occasional one that is willing to sell anything for his alimony payment, but the fact is that most realize after the last decade that scope thus far has been permanent and pay has been temporary.
Everyone would "like" the buying power of C2k, no doubt about it, but the majority of pilots at Delta are willing to wait and see what the conditions dictate. Margins in the upper single digits to lower double digits combined with what APA and UALALPA do will play in to that.
As for what we buy back or do not buy back. Scope is unity. Simple as that. Bring the flying back in house and you can command the pay rates that may expect because you corner the market on Delta flying. We as a pilot group need to answer "yes" to the "IF" before we worry about the "how."
The how has may options but it takes resolve for the "if"
Last edited by acl65pilot; 12-10-2010 at 07:46 AM.
12-10-2010, 07:42 AM
#3495
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
Thanks for the clarification.
You are making a lot of assumptions that may or may not turn out to be true. I'd rather make my objective and my resolve to achieve my objective clear from the start. Your "pattern bargaining" strategy is like a ship without power and a rudder... just floating along and depending on the currents to take you in the general direction of where you want to go.
Hindsight is always 20/20. I'm just not willing to put the future of my career in someone else's hands based on a crystal ball prediction.
You are making a lot of assumptions that may or may not turn out to be true. I'd rather make my objective and my resolve to achieve my objective clear from the start. Your "pattern bargaining" strategy is like a ship without power and a rudder... just floating along and depending on the currents to take you in the general direction of where you want to go.
Hindsight is always 20/20. I'm just not willing to put the future of my career in someone else's hands based on a crystal ball prediction.
12-10-2010, 07:50 AM
#3496
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
12-10-2010, 07:52 AM
#3497
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: 737 Capt
Posts: 1,166
I agree with you on scope but could not disagree more with this statement! In fact, if this thinking is representative of our current MEC, then it pretty much solidifies my inclination that ALPA is incapable of representing us and that a change is warranted. It is very rare and unlikely to achieve anything difficult and significant by adopting a "wait and see" attitude! Can't you see why this is wrong?
^^^^^^^^^ Agree!
12-10-2010, 07:54 AM
#3498
Moderator
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: B757/767
Posts: 13,088
I agree with you on scope but could not disagree more with this statement! In fact, if this thinking is representative of our current MEC, then it pretty much solidifies my inclination that ALPA is incapable of representing us and that a change is warranted. It is very rare and unlikely to achieve anything difficult and significant by adopting a "wait and see" attitude! Can't you see why this is wrong?
You guys honestly believe that we can just negotiate whatever pay rates we want regardless of our peers rates?
12-10-2010, 08:06 AM
#3499
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,530
12-10-2010, 08:08 AM
#3500
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
I'm not doing anything with DPA at this point (other than I sent in a card because I think the debate/vote is worth having) as they do not represent me yet. What I do know is that I would rather go with a somewhat unknown quantity that advocates restoration and believes it is possible, than to stick with a known quantity with a track record of making every excuse in the book why it can't happen and that advocates tying our compensation to the ups and downs of the economy and our industry. If you look at the track record of this industry, we are unlikely to ever make any significant progress by tying our compensation to this industry's profits. To base our strategy on that is very likely to be a failure from the start.
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