tsquare

First.. you need to quote the post you are responding to... we are not in your head, and since you are so prolific, and carry on 2 or 3 discussions simultaneously, you get lost sometimes... but maybe it is just me...

Second.. I will reiterate the same thing that (I believe) DAWGS said earlier.. why are you so vehemently defending the status quo? Why are you so afraid of trying something different? We already know that we have been doing the same thing over and over for years and years.. and it doesn't work so well. Isn't that the definition of insanity?

texavia

They don't have a plan and we don't like them not having a plan to show us!

They are working on a plan and we don't like that either!

acl65pilot

T- Once again, I am not defending status quo, I am arguing against the belief that DPA will be any better than what we have. Does ALPA have issues? Yep, and DPA will too. My stance is fix what you have because it is a lot easier than the alternative. I know you disagree with this and see ALPA Nat as bloated and ineffective. To a certain level I agree, but I blame individuals and not the organization. I prefer to change the ppl not the name on the door. I do not call that insanity.

tsquare

Yes... you are defending the status quo... you are defending ALPA as being better than ANY alternative. You have a closed mind.... but for everyone's amusement.. here ya go...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FAVKG0I6XXA

acl65pilot

In this two choice debate, you are correct. As many are telling ALPA I say to you, convince me.

Apparently plenty of guys have mailed cards in that this may come to a head later this year.

forgot to bid

1,674 posts on one topic.

tsquare

I know it is impossible to convince you of anything because as I have said, your mind is made up and closed. OTOH, I have not decided necessarily one way or the other. I am willing to listen to the DPA side when/if they come up with a plan.. and I am willing (like I have a choice) to give Lee the opportunity to throw out the garbage in Herndon and actually effect some change. I'll believe it when I see it though. He'll get the lobotomy.. and nothing will change.. but it is up to him as to whether I send in a card or not.

Herman

Check...once again "my TSQUARE speaks for me".

slowplay

Yup, and they'e got nothing of substance with which to make an argument.

There are some historical guides and some folks that have walked a DPA like path have posted about them (FedEx Pilots Association, National Pilots Association, Independent Association of Continental Pilots). They all rejoined ALPA. Are there any real success stories for the isolationists/tribalists out there? Nope. "Industry leading" SWAPA undercut ALPA for 32 years, and they still work for just 80% of unadjusted "restoration" as demanded by some here. APA? Only if you count leading the "B"-scale and being first to the concession stand this decade (with still nothing to show for it). Oh, ALPA kicked APA's butt in their last grievance over flows. IPA? Nearlyl 20 years of undercutting cargo rates and a higher dues structure (2.25%) than ALPA.

I'm sure I'll be told I have this wrong, that it's really not just a hope and change movement. Someone will point to substantial success somewhere, right?

Bucking Bar

Slowplay,

You are exactly right. Close friends were part of getting ALPA on the FedEx property and from their first hand accounts, their independent union was ineffective.

I am concerned about our Rep's choices for MEC Chairman. The wrong choice could sure fuel the anti incumbent mood this fall.

The DPA isn't powered by its own agenda. The DPA gets its momentum from frustration with ALPA.