capncrunch

Hi Kettle, your black.

FYI, you have never heard that from DPA, you made that up. Please show us where you saw this...

Splash

Ok. Then what?

This is your chance to explain what you believe in, and share your expectations with us. You think ALPA's blown it.

So answer the questions: Describe the way you'd like to see feedback collected and handled. Should it be done by polling? Should the polling or survey results be published?

I don't think you've thought this through. I'm calling you out on it. Give us the way DPA will do what YOU want them to do.

KC10 FATboy

As a jump seater, I recently witnessed a CA and FO have a very lively discussion regarding pay end benefits. To sum it up, the CA was pro ALPA (said he doesn't know or have ever met Lee Moak), but spoke very fondly of ALPA even pulling out the recent Lee Moak letter that was published just prior to him running for national. The FO was from the DPA school of thought and picked apart pieces in the letter as utter BS.

capncrunch

Now to reverse the question, why do you feel that ALPA will change its spots and represent us equal to the dues dollars we bring in? Also, why do you feel that DPA will not represent Delta pilots?

tsquare

Why don't you tell us what ALPA is going to do for us? In the time I have been here it has been a whole lot of talk.. and little else. And you KNOW that I am talking about national.. not DALPA.... I think the DPA crowd wants the divorce from THAT organization.. not necessarily DALPA.. but I could be wrong.

scambo1

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Splash;

ALPA national has blown it. I have not sent in a card though because I am hopeful that LM will make his plan known for ALPAs direction going forward. I will make my decision based upon his action or inaction.

DPA is an in house union - think of it like DALPA without ALPA national...no agenda beside what is best for the Delta Pilots.

My hat was off to the Comm Chair when he attempted an online poll as opposed to wilson. Unfortunately the results of the poll were not considered scientific enough. I think more of the online polls would be great and useful...Hopefully, more pilots would involve themselves.

I am not at all certain why DPA has to be vilified. Its motives and objectives have to be AT LEAST no less pure than DALPA practicioners - but without ALPA nat'l.

cni187

So looks like us new guys have a lot of listening and learning to do from The CAs we fly with to get up to speed on all this?

NuGuy

Heyas,

Polling, in it's current form, is nothing more than a tool to manage expectations.

To wit:

Would you rather:

1) Take a huge pay cut
2) Give up more scope
3) Give up more work rules
4) Give up more benefits
5) Take a status quo contract

And, lo and behold, nearly %100 vote for a status quo contract! Remarkable!

The question presupposes the answer. Believe me, as someone who did statistical analysis as part of a degree program, this is exactly what goes on.

Ask your rep who comes up with these questions and how they are vetted. Good luck getting answer from the person who does it.

At NWA, we attempted time and time again to wrestle the vetting process away from the officer that did it, and put the questions in front of a committee made up of a cross-section of pilots. We had a pilot, who is probably one of the smartest guys I know, who had a freekin' degree in statistical analysis willing to head up the project, but they would not even consider it.

Though it defies reason, the survey process is THE most political process inside ALPA. It is a tightly kept secret and only the party faithful have the keys. You'd have better luck getting a Scientologist divulge their closest secrets.

Nu

acl65pilot

IMO the gap in the online and scientific is where the real data is. That is where I would be focusing my attention if I were privy.

tsquare

this^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^