Delta Pilots Association
10-18-2010, 06:13 PM
#1371
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,539
10-18-2010, 06:14 PM
#1372
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Carl
10-18-2010, 06:15 PM
#1373
At home on the maddog!
Joined APC: Mar 2009
Position: ATL MD-88A
Posts: 2,874
Furthermore, if all of the ALPA pilots partook in this "Incremental Bites at the Apple" we would be able to pattern up with greater frequency. The steps may be smaller but using a time value money approach it means more money paid to each pilot over the same period of time. It means that you could deal with pay and work rules every few years, and smaller items like the 23K issue etc as needed. It also means that we as ALPA pilots rationalize our wages amongst the carriers so that over time we all get more. (More ALPA carriers and pilot groups making the same pay takes pilot wages out of the variable cost column) If we make the same or are very close shorter contracts are easier to attain and section six cycles will be able to be completed with greater frequency. It allows more stairs to be built quicker.
To me, this is a HUGE risk to take with an unproven concept and something as important as our compensation, which needs to be dug out of a 50% hole.
10-18-2010, 06:16 PM
#1374
The Brown Dot +1
Joined APC: Jun 2009
Position: 777B
Posts: 7,775
The courage of my keyboard? I'm a slow typist so I try to boil down what I say before typing.
ALPAs not a lawn service? You're an errand boy sent by grocery clerks to collect a bill.
10-18-2010, 06:18 PM
#1375
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,539
10-18-2010, 06:18 PM
#1376
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: No to large RJs
Posts: 369
Why are you guys referring to the NPRM as an hour giveback? It is two hours for a total of 10 flight hours for a two man crew between 7am-1259pm base time sign in. This is a huge benefit for the airlines and a blow to safety no matter how you slice it. ALPA proposed 9 in their proposal, which also doesn't reduce fatigue and shows once again ALPA's willingness to let the camel's nose in the tent.
Under the NPRM, two pilots could have a 13 hour duty day, extendable to 15 hours with 10 flight hours. We now have 8 hours in 16 (whitlow) or 15 limited by contract. So now, in the name of safety and reduced fatigue, you get to fly two more hours in the same duty day. Sounds just about like something ALPA would support. How long did it take for CAPA and Sully to come out against this? 24 hours, maybe? Have we heard an official stance from ALPA yet? More back door dealings I guess.
Under the NPRM, two pilots could have a 13 hour duty day, extendable to 15 hours with 10 flight hours. We now have 8 hours in 16 (whitlow) or 15 limited by contract. So now, in the name of safety and reduced fatigue, you get to fly two more hours in the same duty day. Sounds just about like something ALPA would support. How long did it take for CAPA and Sully to come out against this? 24 hours, maybe? Have we heard an official stance from ALPA yet? More back door dealings I guess.
10-18-2010, 06:22 PM
#1377
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
I beleive that the biggest issue is that the rank and file prefer to fight each other than to unite behind a common goal(s). It is easy to throw stones, but quite another to volunteer to do the work that needs to be done. Getting involved is the biggest thing any pilot can do. Do not like the answers demand change, and the best way to do that is to make sure that there are people that are like minded working with you.
Like you have said, the dogma and doctrine are not the issues, it is the interpretation. Find people that interpret it better. We are the people that will be involved with DPA. Our pilots are now predominately in the lead ALPA positions so the it is more than likely that the same people would filter to the top here. We are not ALPA Leadership. If we end up not liking them, the same will be true for DPA in a few cycles.
Like you have said, the dogma and doctrine are not the issues, it is the interpretation. Find people that interpret it better. We are the people that will be involved with DPA. Our pilots are now predominately in the lead ALPA positions so the it is more than likely that the same people would filter to the top here. We are not ALPA Leadership. If we end up not liking them, the same will be true for DPA in a few cycles.
Just keep doing the same thing over and over while hoping for a different result ACL. I think you know what they call that.
Carl
10-18-2010, 06:31 PM
#1379
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
No, "over the top" implies some level of correctness...just said in a flamboyant manner. There's almost nothing correct about what you say. Most of it is demonstrably and easily proved wrong in your vain attempt to shill for your management job. Scambo didn't deserve your comment at all. His response to you was measured.
Don't flatter yourself with the description of over the top. First you have to learn correct.
Carl
Don't flatter yourself with the description of over the top. First you have to learn correct.
Carl
10-18-2010, 06:33 PM
#1380
Back on TDY
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Position: 747-400 Captain
Posts: 12,487
Why are you guys referring to the NPRM as an hour giveback? It is two hours for a total of 10 flight hours for a two man crew between 7am-1259pm base time sign in. This is a huge benefit for the airlines and a blow to safety no matter how you slice it. ALPA proposed 9 in their proposal, which also doesn't reduce fatigue and shows once again ALPA's willingness to let the camel's nose in the tent.
Under the NPRM, two pilots could have a 13 hour duty day, extendable to 15 hours with 10 flight hours. We now have 8 hours in 16 (whitlow) or 15 limited by contract. So now, in the name of safety and reduced fatigue, you get to fly two more hours in the same duty day. Sounds just about like something ALPA would support. How long did it take for CAPA and Sully to come out against this? 24 hours, maybe? Have we heard an official stance from ALPA yet? More back door dealings I guess.
Under the NPRM, two pilots could have a 13 hour duty day, extendable to 15 hours with 10 flight hours. We now have 8 hours in 16 (whitlow) or 15 limited by contract. So now, in the name of safety and reduced fatigue, you get to fly two more hours in the same duty day. Sounds just about like something ALPA would support. How long did it take for CAPA and Sully to come out against this? 24 hours, maybe? Have we heard an official stance from ALPA yet? More back door dealings I guess.
Carl
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
Lbell911
Regional
23
04-22-2012 10:33 AM
