TonyWilliams

Having just calmed down from getting an RA at FL270, I was wondering how often this happens to us on average.

Does any airline SOP have an airway offset criteria for the purpose of preventing opposite direction midairs, particularly in the GPS "dead" center world?

As to bird strikes, I guess that depends where you're operating. But, I hit a lot of birds. And finally, engine outs are hopefully as rare as decompressions, but I wonder which is more?

Yes, I'm bored.

Sniper

Many do when flying out of radar coverage (over the oceans generally, but Africa and South America would be the same if out of coverage. In coverage, but coverage is 'lackadaisical' - most would SLOP, but the regulations would govern whether that is 'technically' the right thing to do, and it's probably not, I'm guessing). When in radar coverage, it is usually regulated as to what off-set you fly, if any, by the country controlling the airspace. China usually assigns an off-set before they get you in coverage, and then puts you on centerline once in coverage, for instance.

Virtually everyone applies SLOP when flying the tracks, thus tending to shift the whole track 1-2 miles. Makes me think that the most 'strategic' offset is 0 NM's (fly the centerline of the track) where nobody else is.

cal73

In 10 years of line flying I have had 4 that I can easily remember.

YQB x1
EWR x3
CLE x1

georgetg

Tony,

Where you are, yes SLOP is SOP...
Strategic Lateral Offset Procedure

After GOL 73NG vs Emb. Legacy in Brasil, I figured everybody is doing this...

Cheers
George

hoserpilot

If your talking about your recent Africa trip then yeah offset is standard. Radio calls in the blind, offsets, put down the paper, turn up the radio, listen to others, hope its not your time. When I've been to Europe on the tracks, Africa, or South America I've almost always had an offset. For the big D offsets on the tracks or south america are recommended. Offsets in Africa are required.

As far as birds.....take it from me, don't land at Renton, Washington from the north, at night, when all those darn ducks and geese walk up the float plane ramp and sleep on the runway.

Worst RA was back in your home turf. Fresno controller forgot to tell us about a VFR Falcon 50 climbing outta FAT. TCAS couldn't make up its mind...climb descend climb. Luckily I saw the a/c and avoided it or I'd be pushing up daisies along with all my pax.

(edited due to beer influencing my post)

TonyWilliams

I'm sending a memo to our CP and DFO today to address the SLOP thing.

As to the Brazil accident, I don't think they were opposite direction, so any offset would have been just luck if they missed (somebody is still crossing somebody else's nose at the same altitude).

TonyWilliams

Required? If it's not SOP, or an actual regulation, I don't see it as required. Perhaps accepted or recommended practice by Jeppessen?

I won't be able to consistently talk the other crew member into offsets if I don't have something that says we have to do it. And then, when to you cease offsetting? 10,000 feet? On final?

Gotta be rules.



When TCAS first started, and I was working the south side of Oakland Center, I had an American MD do a multi-thousand foot climb, causing ALL kinds of problems. Fortunately, the current version of TCAS is quite refined.

TCAS shouldn't be giving any lateral guidance. Climb / Descend only.

NismoRacer

I'll tell you what. The scariest thing is when the tcas tells you to descend and you have the A/C insight 500 ft below you. What do you do then? They say you should always do what the tcas tells you too. In this case which happened to me going into OMA. We had a Cessna 210 insight 500 feet below us when we got the TA. We where descending into OMA, as we descended further we got the RA telling us to descend. My thought was wow I cant believe the tcas told us to descend at 1500ft per min. I ignored it and climbed. The tcas then changed its mind, after I started to climb, to a 1500ft climb. That was really crazy. If I would have followed the tcas in the first place, I might not be here telling this story. Make you think if tcas is right all the time. Thank god we saw the other plane and didnt descend.

iceman49

SLOP is in an FAA AC

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/...x_Dev_SLOP.doc.

Search the FAA website, there is a lot of info on the SLOP

50drvr

Numerous TCAS RAs. As a corporate operator, I fly to a lot of uncontrolled airports where most of my RAs have occurred. If you are really paying attention to traffic enroute, you can reduce your rate of climb/descent (< 1,000 FPM) as appropriate when within 5 miles of other aircraft to reduce the potential for TAs or RAs. SLOP is a great idea, not only for RAs but for avoiding wake turbulence upsets.

Have had numerous bird strikes during my career. Most serious.....softball sized hole in leading edge of C-130 wing once and another time, took one down an engine intake on a Herk during a touch and go resulting in a nice fire ball and flameout. Use radar during takeoff or landing - swear it helps. Getting ready to depart Angel Fire, New Mexico yesterday, noticed several bald eagles standing adjacent to runway......asked FBO to send car out to disperse before we rolled.

Fortunately, no rapid decompressions to date (knock on wood....)

Engine failures in the Falcon world are rare.....however I had a fuel control malfunction which caused a flame out climbing through 10,000' on beautiful VMC day once. Had numerous prop/engine malfunctions during military flying (but had usually had three remaining good engines to get us home!)