Allegiant
01-30-2010, 06:15 AM
#91
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: MD80 Captain
Posts: 165
Only you and the rest of your fellow Allegiant pilots would know whether the company is living up to the agreement or not, so I won't comment on that, but I will say that the document is NOT legally binding in any way whatsoever. The company can change it at a whim if they so choose.
Only a true contract negotiated by a legally-recognized collective bargaining agent under the auspices of the NMB would be legally binding.
Only a true contract negotiated by a legally-recognized collective bargaining agent under the auspices of the NMB would be legally binding.
Our contract is 100% legally binding. We do not get the same protections as you do under the RLA, but it is a legally binding enforceable contract nonetheless. Our means of enforcement may be costly and not ideal, but again, completely enforceable.
Why don't you stick to things you know about.... Paying for your training and spewing ALPA rhetoric.
01-30-2010, 07:19 AM
#92
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 69
PCL, you think an alpa contract is ironclad? Ask people at trans states what happened when Hulas wanted an alter ego airline (which was in direct violation of our CBA). He just created one and said the contract didn't apply, and the judges agreed. The contract was worthless. So please dont act like an ALPA contract is worth a dime these days. It isnt. Im not anti-union, but lets be honest.
01-30-2010, 07:33 AM
#94
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Recovering Airline Pilot
Posts: 460
Once again you don't have a clue PCL, and you can only repeat what ALPA has told you.
Our contract is 100% legally binding. We do not get the same protections as you do under the RLA, but it is a legally binding enforceable contract nonetheless. Our means of enforcement may be costly and not ideal, but again, completely enforceable.
Why don't you stick to things you know about.... Paying for your training and spewing ALPA rhetoric.
Our contract is 100% legally binding. We do not get the same protections as you do under the RLA, but it is a legally binding enforceable contract nonetheless. Our means of enforcement may be costly and not ideal, but again, completely enforceable.
Why don't you stick to things you know about.... Paying for your training and spewing ALPA rhetoric.
01-30-2010, 09:27 AM
#95
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 712
You can spew all of the venom you want, but I'm sorry, you're just not correct. APAAG is not a legally recognized entity, so their signature on the TA (do they even bother to sign it?) would be meaningless. What would be enforceable, is what JetBlue has, which is an individual contract for each pilot signed by both the company and the pilot. Of course, even though that's enforceable, it's incredibly expensive for an individual pilot to take the company to court to enforce the deal.
Seems like you are just in here trying to stir the pot. Sorry, just what it looks like.
01-30-2010, 09:34 AM
#97
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2010
Position: MD80
Posts: 188
• Adjusted Ladders:
Captains
Years Current Band 1 Band 2 Band 3 Band 4
1 61 118 124 131 138
2 87 121 127 134 141
3 95 123 129 136 143
4 102 124 130 137 144
5 107 125 131 138 145
6 110 126 132 139 146
7 113 128 134 141 148
8 116 130 136 143 150
9 120 133 139 146 153
10 124 135 141 148 155
11 124 138 144 151 158
12 124 140 146 153 160
First Officers
Years Current Band 1 Band 2 Band 3 Band 4
1 41 41 41 41 41
2 55 60 63 66 70
3 57 68 73 78 83
4 59 72 77 82 87
5 61 78 83 88 93
6 61 82 87 92 97
7 61 82 87 92 97
8 61 82 87 92 97
9 61 82 87 92 97
10 61 82 87 92 97
11 61 82 87 92 97
12 61 82 87 92 97
The program is based on a four tiered system. There are four different possible pay scales for each status (Capt, and FO). Each scale is tied to a benchmark of operational profitability. The company’s performance will be compared to these benchmarks twice a year at the end of the 1st and 3rd quarters by examining the preceding 12 months. There will then be a 1 month period for the payroll to be adjusted. The pay scale for the next 6 months will be determined by this method.
Pay Scale Operating Margin Bands:
Band 1 Band 2 Band 3 Band 4
MIN 8.00% 14.00% 20.00%
MAX 7.99% 13.99% 19.99%
Recent history demonstrates that we may fall into any pay band. Wall Street analyst consensus projections for our company’s performance predict that we will fall into “band 3” level profit margins for 2010 (14% - 19.99%).
These pay scales will commence on May 1, 2010. For the first 12 months of the agreement (May 10 – Apr 11) we will be locked into the “band 3” pay rates or better.
Captains
Years Current Band 1 Band 2 Band 3 Band 4
1 61 118 124 131 138
2 87 121 127 134 141
3 95 123 129 136 143
4 102 124 130 137 144
5 107 125 131 138 145
6 110 126 132 139 146
7 113 128 134 141 148
8 116 130 136 143 150
9 120 133 139 146 153
10 124 135 141 148 155
11 124 138 144 151 158
12 124 140 146 153 160
First Officers
Years Current Band 1 Band 2 Band 3 Band 4
1 41 41 41 41 41
2 55 60 63 66 70
3 57 68 73 78 83
4 59 72 77 82 87
5 61 78 83 88 93
6 61 82 87 92 97
7 61 82 87 92 97
8 61 82 87 92 97
9 61 82 87 92 97
10 61 82 87 92 97
11 61 82 87 92 97
12 61 82 87 92 97
The program is based on a four tiered system. There are four different possible pay scales for each status (Capt, and FO). Each scale is tied to a benchmark of operational profitability. The company’s performance will be compared to these benchmarks twice a year at the end of the 1st and 3rd quarters by examining the preceding 12 months. There will then be a 1 month period for the payroll to be adjusted. The pay scale for the next 6 months will be determined by this method.
Pay Scale Operating Margin Bands:
Band 1 Band 2 Band 3 Band 4
MIN 8.00% 14.00% 20.00%
MAX 7.99% 13.99% 19.99%
Recent history demonstrates that we may fall into any pay band. Wall Street analyst consensus projections for our company’s performance predict that we will fall into “band 3” level profit margins for 2010 (14% - 19.99%).
These pay scales will commence on May 1, 2010. For the first 12 months of the agreement (May 10 – Apr 11) we will be locked into the “band 3” pay rates or better.
01-30-2010, 09:47 AM
#98
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Recovering Airline Pilot
Posts: 460
Not at all. I just want to make sure that your pilots are getting the facts so you can make an educated decision. I would hate for someone to vote against representation merely because of incorrect information that leads them to believe that their "TA" is enforceable.
01-30-2010, 10:02 AM
#99
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Posts: 712
The TA is enforceable and maybe some people dont want a union? Unions make up about 15% of the U.S. work force, which says a lot. I have worked for unions and worked non union, if I had my choice unions would be outlawed and we wouldnt be having this conversation. What is a union going to do for anyone? Answer.........nothing that is in your best interest.
01-30-2010, 10:09 AM
#100
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Recovering Airline Pilot
Posts: 460
Find a labor attorney that will back you up on that, and I'll give you $100. I'm not too worried about having to pay up. 
The more relevant figure is that 93% of airline pilots in this country are unionized. That says a lot.
Unions make up about 15% of the U.S. work force, which says a lot.
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