Eric Stratton

Why can't he bring up a real problem in regards to airspace. Isn't that part of the problem these days?

I know of 1 airline that runs 6 flights a day (50 seater) out of a particular airport instead of the 3 (737) that they used to do into a NYC airport. That adds to congestion and time on the ground.

Isn't it more the 3.5 hour rule now. 3 hours and then the captain has to believe that they can get off the ground in the next 30 minutes?

TPROP4ever

Because most pilots do not get the time from "out" to "off" unless they get off the ground...so you lose three hours, by the way it seems the only thing that might make up a little of this is the duty rig, if it pushes you deep enough into this teritory, but in my airlines case that 2 to 1 so I might get an hour out of it. All this being said Ive personally only sat on the pad for 1.5 hrs before during a ground stop and Ill keep knocking on wood. Other reason pilots are unhappy about this, is simply it takes the decision making out of the hands of the flight crew. I dare say most pilots are not going to sit past the 3 hours if it is in any way avoidable, just to tick off the pax, and my next question is this so you left and sat on the taxiway for 3 and the pax want to deplane, are they going to allow us to be sued because there isnt a gate available when we get back, weve all seen how they schedule this stuff, or are we just going to let them out on the ramp....?(Im being sarcastic)

The other issue I see is now you go back to the gate, at what point do you reload and make another attempt at sitting on the ground for 3 more hours, Ground control and tower and departure arn't going to let you just leave your gate again and go right to the runway to get off the ground ahead of everyone else, lets face it a 3 hr ground delay means everyone is waiting for 3 hours, not just one specific plane, so when you head back out it is for round number 2.

Wasatch Phantom

A number of years ago I flew the 727 on Delta's shuttle operation. It was not uncommon to have a weather delay lasting well over an hour. Occasionally there would be a passenger who was flying to a meeting and the delay would cause him to miss the meeting. At that point the pax had no desire to fly, and would inform the flight attendants of the situation.

We would call operations and they'd send someone out to the aircraft in a radio equipped pickup truck. They'd drop the aft airstair the pax would get off and we'd fly to our destination (eventually).

The system worked well and passengers were grateful for that option.

TPROP4ever

Thanks again in part to unethical lawyers and years of frivolous lawsuit abuse this common sense approach would never FLY (no pun intended) today, because of the Liability issue

FlyBoyd

If a passenger leaves the plane aren't their bags removed as well? This "quick" trip back to the gate would also include finding the pax's bags too right? Cargo doors near inlet/exhaust requiring engine shutdown increasing the time even more....etc, etc.

HIFLYR

And the whole time 3 hr you had the seat belt sign on. I have never understood why you pax guys sit in the penalty box with a engine shut down and keep the seat belt sign on; company regs? While dead heading and seen it where most of the operating crew goes to the head and all the passengers are trying to tie an knot in it or cork it.

Scoop

This whole issue is an attempt to regulate and codify common sense. First of all 3+ hour times are very rare and 5+ hour times are extremely rare. Do we really want to put in place a regulation because it affects .0001 or less percent of all flights. If this happens once it is national news and people assume it is happening all the time. It usually is weather related, and in any case let the Captain and dispatch make the call - not some screwed up politicians. Airlines know how much bad press they receive on this issue and go to great lengths to avoid it. If they really are concerned about it how about building some new airports. Oh I forgot NIMBY.

Scoop

deltabound

You'd be amazed how quickly a solid:

"1 hour wheel's up time" can turn into a

"can you take an immediate? . . but it's only good if you're wheel's up in 90 seconds".

usmc-sgt

Im with HSLD. I get block or better so I am more than happy to sit, gate return and go sit again. Hell with a 4 or 5 leg day I will get close to timing out and they will just cancel my last round trip and pay protect me for it with less work. Sounds like a win for me.

There are not many times I have sat on the runway for 3 hours but when it has happened it has been legit. Three times on CAL 73's going either to or from BOS and twice in the dash 8 during work at various airports.

Typical scenario: do not board in DCA for two hours because we have an EDCT time. We finally board and push 35-30 minutes prior with the hopes of getting lucky. After calling for taxi we get a call and hear "EWR just groundstopped, update in an hour." We tell the pax and wait out the hour only to get extended again. So we finally get an EDCT time again after an hour and a half and are about to launch and DCA stops departures because of thunderstorms in the area, fine, another half hour. Time to go again, DCA has cleared only to find out EWR has stopped again because of thunderstorms in their area.

Finally launch after a 3+ hour sit on the tarmac. Suck? Of course it does but we had reason to believe that upon pushing and taxiing we would be airborne in 30 and then had reason to believe we would be airborne in an hour and you get the idea.

It happens. As mentioned earlier after the excessively long story that anyone who flies in the northeast knows all about is that it is all fine with me, I get paid regardless.

VideoGuy

How would all of this work if there was a ground stop? Recently, my wife was going from CHO to LGA and LGA had a ground stop for most of the afternoon for weather. While they never got on the plane in CHO for the 3-4 hr delay (sorry, can't remember how long they waited), at LGA are they pulling all the planes back in off the taxi and runways? And where would you put everybody? Just curious how this would "work" if it takes effect.