AMR responds to pilot union’s billboards
03-20-2009, 04:01 AM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Position: 737 CA MIA
Posts: 1,042
ironspud's sig line 604 804 is ode to the standard ex TWA brief.
When i first started with AA I too, thought the Flight Instruments Switches Bugs response on the checklist was too long. I remember thinking, "Is this guy going to respond to every switch position?" Then OMG he's still yacking away.
When I flew for Horizon Air we used to be able to say "Standard Brief"
for TO brief, or appr brief.
ironspud how's that 747 CA job paying you $98 bucks an hour going?
You do realize there are guys that think YOU are paid plenty well, and in light of our deflationary economy can be considered overpaid. You have no case for a new contract.
I took PSY in college and studied Jung. There is a personality profile called "The Hero" archetype. This is a person whom when facing what appears to be insurmountable odds He throws his arms up in the air and resigns.
You apparently are ex-TWA and are furloughed. I may never understand the depths of what you've been thru. I can only emphathize.
As you are aware yes there are some things not going well at APA right now. But this group will get a contract. It will be worth coming back for.
Negotiations are negotiations. Both sides don't want to back down. Both sides sing the blues.
I would not do one thing different than APA's opener. Does or has AA managment considered the economy when they've awarded themselve over 265 Million in the last 3 years in bonuses. That's almost all the money they've made in the last three years. Hint, the economy has been bad the last three years.
If the time for you to return to AA happens I do not think you'll feel this way.
I am glad that APA's will not negotiate against itself. Only in the final hour of negotiations does the real negotiating start.
In this declining economy, using your opinion, why did the Alaska pilots appear to be close to getting some raise?
Aren't they and their managment operating in the same economy?
Sincerely,
7576
03-20-2009, 04:47 AM
#12
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: B-737
Posts: 392
APA has a valid point: No Exec bonuses until AMR is profitable. But, AA has a point---they can't give unrealistically high raises in this economy (but it doesn't hurt to ask!). By the time this all gets worked out, I'll bet AMR is profitable, the economy has recovered and APA will get raises. And while you're at it---FIX THE RSV SYSTEM! Best of luck.
03-20-2009, 07:36 AM
#13
AAmerican Way for AA Pay
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Position: B-737 Pilot
Posts: 1,617
What are your fears? That they'll farm out all domestic NB to Eagle? I think Eagle is big enough, and has plenty of RJs---what is it, like 275 jets now? Scope is definately important. Just not the only thing.
03-20-2009, 08:10 AM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: Stage Left
Posts: 366
AMR Corp., the parent company of American Airlines Inc., has called the placement of two billboards by the Allied Pilots Association near Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport ‘the latest in a series of desperate attacks to put pressure on the company so it will give into the APA’s outrageous contract demands.”
The billboards, located on the south side of State Highway 183 in Euless and the east side of State Highway 360 in Arlington, point out that executive bonuses at the airline since 2006 have totaled $296.5 million. One version states that 27,000 jobs have been lost at the airline in recent years.
In response, American spokeswoman Missy Latham said: “It’s important to note that our management compensation is market-based, similar to that of many U.S. businesses including airlines. It is the same structure that has been in place for more than 10 years and is designed to align the long-term interests of shareholders and management. The value to individuals is completely at-risk and based on strict performance criteria.”
The airline also said the APA signs do not include statistics that compare American salaries to the market average.
“We’ve been very clear with the current APA leadership team that signing a deal that puts our pilot costs 275 percent above the industry average is not an option,” the airline said. “While we continue to look for ways to find workable, realistic and positive changes to our pilot contract, misguided attacks like this are disappointing and detrimental to the negotiations process.”
According to a statement put out by the APA, senior executives at American are due to receive bonuses again next month. "By contrast, the pilots have given up billions in compensation since 2003. During the same period, thousands of pilots lost their jobs through furloughs, while many of those remaining had their pay cut in half."
APA's statement said the group objects to the "extremely disparate rate of financial recovery between senior executives and front-line employees, and believes that shared sacrifice should result in shared reward."
Copyright 2009 bizjournals.com
AMR responds to pilot union?s billboards: bizjournals.com Business News - MSN Money
Is losing millions per quarter part of the "strict performance criteria?"
275% above the industry average?? How can these quoted personnel keep a straight face while saying these things?? They need to go to Hollywood where they can make more money as actors/actresses.
The billboards, located on the south side of State Highway 183 in Euless and the east side of State Highway 360 in Arlington, point out that executive bonuses at the airline since 2006 have totaled $296.5 million. One version states that 27,000 jobs have been lost at the airline in recent years.
In response, American spokeswoman Missy Latham said: “It’s important to note that our management compensation is market-based, similar to that of many U.S. businesses including airlines. It is the same structure that has been in place for more than 10 years and is designed to align the long-term interests of shareholders and management. The value to individuals is completely at-risk and based on strict performance criteria.”
The airline also said the APA signs do not include statistics that compare American salaries to the market average.
“We’ve been very clear with the current APA leadership team that signing a deal that puts our pilot costs 275 percent above the industry average is not an option,” the airline said. “While we continue to look for ways to find workable, realistic and positive changes to our pilot contract, misguided attacks like this are disappointing and detrimental to the negotiations process.”
According to a statement put out by the APA, senior executives at American are due to receive bonuses again next month. "By contrast, the pilots have given up billions in compensation since 2003. During the same period, thousands of pilots lost their jobs through furloughs, while many of those remaining had their pay cut in half."
APA's statement said the group objects to the "extremely disparate rate of financial recovery between senior executives and front-line employees, and believes that shared sacrifice should result in shared reward."
Copyright 2009 bizjournals.com
AMR responds to pilot union?s billboards: bizjournals.com Business News - MSN Money
Is losing millions per quarter part of the "strict performance criteria?"
275% above the industry average?? How can these quoted personnel keep a straight face while saying these things?? They need to go to Hollywood where they can make more money as actors/actresses.
Oh boy...
If this spokeswoman is speaking on behalf of that management staff (which is safe to conclude), they have some seriously, seriously flawed ideas on compensation and management "packages".
03-20-2009, 10:11 AM
#16
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 1,109
If you have to fight for one thing, Scope should be it. Look at what's happened to TSA with Gojet, Midwest with RAH, and United with that new "arrangement" with Aer Lingus... Management would have NO problem farming out as much flying as they could get away with...
03-20-2009, 10:35 AM
#17
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,350
I think it's pretty clear that AMR believes it cannot afford to bend over and has no plans to. The APA cannot afford to blink (lest their leadership be drawn and quartered by the membership), so that means the most likely scenario is a nasty confrontation that the courts will ultimately solve.
Look for a much smaller AA and substantially relaxed scope. AMR ultimately believes it will be more profitable and competitive with that equation anyway and although many pilots might quit, they'll be hideously overstaffed anyway if there plan comes to fruition.
Barring a sudden and unlikely embracement of compromise by the APA, this conflagration is inevitable and IMO, AMR will come out far less bloody then the pilots.
03-20-2009, 10:38 AM
#18
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Posts: 8,350
Don't ya just love it ?
03-20-2009, 11:50 AM
#19
Underboob King
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Guppy Commander
Posts: 4,412
BINGO! I agree 100%
03-20-2009, 02:05 PM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jun 2008
Position: Reclined
Posts: 2,168
Ummm, very much understated. You make no bones trying to pick on APA guys as being at or near the top in the industry per this website (which only reviews hourly scales and does not include duty hours, reassignment rules and quality of life issues)... and then whitewash it with "the same can be said of management." Go do some research, AMR management is in many cases paid 10 times more than the nearest competitor.... before their bonus money is figured in...
You can keep making snide remarks, or you can admitt that in 2003 when every single employee of this company kept the place out of bankruptcy on the promise of management to make things right..... only to be shafted while they rolled around in money.
In the old days, if a company did well, everybody did well, from the top CEO on down to the washroom cleaner... the old methods of business management are gone. Replaced by the "me" generation... raised by MTV, and taught that ethics are meaningless so long as you glean every cent of profit you can from anyplace you can get it. That is the mentality of airline management the last 20 years.
The rest of the nation is only now beginning to realize what airline employees have been dealing with over the last few decades, since now Wall Street has taken a page from airline management play books and are doign the same thing. Run the business into the ground, steal every penny you can, then "reorganize" in bankruptcy, or get a government bailout. Airlines used to do that ALL THE TIME.... nobody did anything to stop it. Airline business models are being used in top Ivy League Schools to teach business administration... is it any wonder we have the economical mess we have today?
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