acl65pilot

Seriously, are you kidding? Do you now understand it?
Trust me millions in training events would be saved by this. DAL4 knows he has worked with this before and is quite intimate with the costs associated with it.
Training costs are huge, and saving however little it may be is going to be noticed by the bean counters.
Even adding one sim to a syllabus here at DAL takes years of data to prove its need. (no I am not kidding)

DAL4EVER

I don't know if you are mainline or regional. Some pilots are guarded when pilots from other carriers approach them and talk to them about their views. They may have been dismissive because they didn't know who they were talking to.

Eric Stratton

I agree but how we got here is still the problem. It's the idea of "what do I care. It doesn't affect me." It started along time ago and continues to get bigger. I thought for sure we saw the end after the 50 seaters and 911 but it still grew. Nothing was even done about it on this last contract that you had. Even with the thought of grounding dc9's and potential furloughs.

The arrogance (ego) that somehow someone is a better pilot (or deserves more) based on size of equipment or the distance it travels has got to change.

Eric Stratton

Explain the "Seriously, are you kidding?" comment. Because no I wasn't.

Show me in very laymen terms where the savings kicks in for the number of training cycles. At the most right now you have an extra 83 training cycles to back fill the compass flow ups. If they are stapled, they can ALL bid out and with the retirements that you talk about in 4 years I seriously doubt many would stay in those seats unless the pay increased. (and drastically for the FO's)

acl65pilot

It has nothing to do with what an RJ guy deserves or what an Mainline guy deserves.
It has to do with the fact that the flying that the DCI carriers do is contracted flying. Our parent company contacted your employer and signed a contract to do our flying for us. It is Delta's flying not the DCI carriers' flying.
What we are trying to do or would like to do is capture the flying that is first and foremost the greatest threat to our current flying. It has nothing to do with you or any regional pilot or the respect or benefits given to you.
If you want to get on the bandwagon and agree that we as a mainline carrier need our flying back, I welcome you to it. I want you on our list either way. I want you to come with your jets and turboprops, but those are few and far between in the DCI system.

Eric Stratton

What would they have to be guarded for if they knew how I worked for?

The conversations were never heated or hostile because when they go that route all you get is emotional talk. It's like talking politics or religion. You have to keep it civil.

acl65pilot

One way to do it is to reinstate the 2 year training freeze on your first assigned piece of equipment. I for one am willing to have that back to get CPZ on the list.

Serious, that you can not see a cost saving. Really do you not want CPZ on the mainline list? If so, why not? Does that hurt you?

Also do not type the CPZ FO's give them an SIC type. Huge savings there.

You will have some movement off that seat. No doubt about it, but you need to realize that it will be a lot less than the current arrangement.
Initially you would see movement as we all did when DAL opened its doors, but after a while people get to a place they like. The left seat of a 175 is a nice place for a lot of people. We have guys on bypass in the left seat of the 190/95 at some operators. They could have come back to a pay raise and a bigger jet, but opted to stay put until their QOL at DAL matched what they had doing this "RJ" job.
Under the current agreement the list at CPZ gets flushed every four years. Even DAL's junior jets of years past have never seen that. (That is a huge point) Also, I do not think that anyone went to CPZ to make a career out of it. They went there to get to mainline!

shadyops

I am a Compass pilot and I don't think anyone owes me a job. But as far as being a fellow pilot and fellow human being, you should respect us. You are smart and realize we didn't "take" your flying. You created CPZ, and I applied because I was on furlough. We were both forced to do things we didn't want to do, so why don't we work together and change it?

DAL4EVER

I don't think its arrogance. I think its pride. I know that to get to DAL I had been flying for 14 years. Flight instruction, college flight team, ferried aircraft, night freight, regional. I worked hard, studied long and maintained a flawless record for checkrides. I prepared hard for the interview because DAL was ALWAYS my destination. I am guarded about a 200 hour wonder becoming a DAL pilot and not going through similar hoops. I know the interview standards, the aptitude of many regional new hires is no where near the same level as a new-hire at DAL. Its not ego or arrogance. Its reality. That has nothing to do with protecting one's flying however.

Eric Stratton

It might not have a lot do do with what people deserve to you, but there are people out there who think that way. Too many pilots only look north of their current spot and never look south. I've run into quite a few who think regional pilots are a second class type of pilot. They haven't paid there dues yet. They think why should I look out for people behind me. My response is "because that guy north of you, in the widebody, should be looking out for you, the narrowbody pilot."

There is even a new hire at delta on this board who doesn't think compass pilots should be stapled because they wouldn't have to go through the same interview that he did. Why is it that he voiced this opinion against compass pilots and not the northwest pilots. I also saw someone complain that there is an NWA new hire that was rejected at delta and they thought it was bs that he would now be a delta pilot.

Ego and what people think they deserve will have a lot to do with it.

ps I've been on that bandwagon with a microphone for quite awhile now. I'm all for getting flying back to mainline.