AA Furlough info
06-22-2008, 11:50 AM
#1
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Position: B-737
Posts: 392
AA Furlough info
Latest furlough recall class (June 4) was briefed by the VP of flight that furlough recalls have been stopped for now. No official word yet as they are still figuring out how large (or small) the airline will be. Probably will not be anymore furloughs for this year unless oil goes to $200/bbl. Then all bets will be off. Complicating matters is age 65. Right now about 50% of pilots at AA are staying beyond age 60.
06-22-2008, 12:38 PM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 652
How is the A fund at risk? I must have missed something....
B fund is mine, it can not be taken through BK. A large chunk of the "lump sum" is from the units accrued in the B fund.
The A fund is vulnerable "if" we enter BK "and" if it were under funded. It is currently %110-%115 funded.
The there is no risk right now, there may be no risk for awhile.
Not flying for AA I wouldn't expect you to know how it works, in fact many of our pilots do not understand how there pension works.
Regards,
AAflyer
06-22-2008, 01:17 PM
#4
A moment please...
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: Just passin' thru
Posts: 769
06-22-2008, 01:51 PM
#5
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,108
How is the A fund at risk? I must have missed something....
B fund is mine, it can not be taken through BK. A large chunk of the "lump sum" is from the units accrued in the B fund.
The A fund is vulnerable "if" we enter BK "and" if it were under funded. It is currently %110-%115 funded.
The there is no risk right now, there may be no risk for awhile.
Not flying for AA I wouldn't expect you to know how it works, in fact many of our pilots do not understand how there pension works.
Regards,
AAflyer
B fund is mine, it can not be taken through BK. A large chunk of the "lump sum" is from the units accrued in the B fund.
The A fund is vulnerable "if" we enter BK "and" if it were under funded. It is currently %110-%115 funded.
The there is no risk right now, there may be no risk for awhile.
Not flying for AA I wouldn't expect you to know how it works, in fact many of our pilots do not understand how there pension works.
Regards,
AAflyer
Is the A Fund firewalled from AMR's finances? Ie can AMR make required deposits but are physically blocked from making any withdrawals at all?
If AMR can, through any mechanism, access those funds then I would not consider them 100% secure. Hopefully they in the hands of a trust or seperate management organization?
06-22-2008, 02:22 PM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 652
UAL,DAL, etc had pensions under funded when they went into BK.
For what it is worth, Fear can be spread by lack of understanding.
AAflyer
Yes, tell your neighbor that his pension will be gone!! All of it. All senior farts run, run and get out while you can. I would love to move up a couple thousand numbers.
06-22-2008, 02:26 PM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 652
Is the A Fund firewalled from AMR's finances? Ie can AMR make required deposits but are physically blocked from making any withdrawals at all?
If AMR can, through any mechanism, access those funds then I would not consider them 100% secure. Hopefully they in the hands of a trust or seperate management organization?
If AMR can, through any mechanism, access those funds then I would not consider them 100% secure. Hopefully they in the hands of a trust or seperate management organization?
I agree that in the end NOTHING is 100%, however lack of understanding has many of our own pilots not understanding the pension. There are vast amounts of information on our union's website about the A and B fund work.
Like I said, nothing is 100%, however they are well funded and safe at the this time.
AAflyer
P.S. At 36 year of age I wish it was crumbling apart, and threatened. I would love to have a couple thousand guys ahead of me bail.
06-22-2008, 02:32 PM
#8
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Joined APC: Aug 2005
Position: Retired 121 pilot
Posts: 1,033
I don't remember the exact dates, but the UAL A-Fund was at 115% perhaps 12-18 months before 9/11, so things can change rather quickly. One thing that bit us bad was that the company had "credits" due to the over-funding and the use of these credits permitted the company to skip otherwise required payments, exacerbating the decline of the overall fund value.
06-22-2008, 03:12 PM
#9
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: 767A (Ret)
Posts: 6,248
They bet with your money
Another risk: "100% funded" means only that the projected value of the investments will exactly equal known future requirements. Fund managers are thus motivated to avoid conservative, low-risk instruments because they offer a lower return, requiring more contributions from the company. Overly optimistic growth assumptions make today's bottom line, and today's executives, look better. 
06-22-2008, 04:02 PM
#10
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Posts: 652
I don't remember the exact dates, but the UAL A-Fund was at 115% perhaps 12-18 months before 9/11, so things can change rather quickly. One thing that bit us bad was that the company had "credits" due to the over-funding and the use of these credits permitted the company to skip otherwise required payments, exacerbating the decline of the overall fund value.
Like I said a little earlier, nothing is for sure, there is just not a present need to go running for the door.
Thanks for the info,
AAflyer
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