UAL going out of business?
05-23-2008, 12:31 PM
#31
A moment please...
Joined APC: Sep 2007
Position: Just passin' thru
Posts: 769
Probably. The other poster said 1-1.5 billion would be enough, I was just giving the last BK as reference. Cash burn rate is a factor too. UAL will lose close to 800 million this Q in my estimation.
05-23-2008, 12:58 PM
#32
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: Sitting
Posts: 96
The pin head in DC did not help matters by going into Iraq. Not that you can put a price on human life, but how much money has been spent with no end or return on cost in sight? We got bigger problems than airlines tanking, and it ain't gonna get any better any time soon. Since the Carter administration, never has any group of worthless politicians been so disconnected from reality. Well at least Dick "Gunner" Chaney and is friends, George and who? are making a bundle from the oil situation ala Haliburton. Lets all learn to tap dance.
Dudes, every single penny spent by the United States Government is authorized by the United States Congress. Please do not forget that the 535 retards that make up the House and Senate continue to fund the war, foreign aid, their pork barrel projects AND they won't allow "big oil" to drill in ANWR or in the continental shelf. Yes the Executive branch sucks but I put more blame on the pork barrel pigs in Congress. Heck we are only 9.5 trillion in debt, why stop there?
I think the whole economy will tank soon. Diesel is $4.50 a gallon here in the Southeast US, no wonder everything we buy in the store keeps getting more expensive.
Anyone heard of any trucking companies going out of business anytime soon? Wouldn't surprise me.
Buzz
05-23-2008, 01:02 PM
#33
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: 737 CA
Posts: 2,576
05-23-2008, 01:14 PM
#35
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: Capt
Posts: 3,215
Hi.
UAL:
The 1st problem that UAL had, was that their Strategic Plan, approved by an idiot judge, to get out of their former CH11 bankruptcy was based on $50/barrell of oil. The people who made the plan, and the judge who approved it were not realistic at all. Since coming out of bankruptcy, all their CEO has been thinking about was merging, when he should've update their strategic plan for very expensive oil.
Oil/Gasoline Pricing:
I believe that the amount of speculation, and weak US dollar in the current price are both negligible. It's all about supply and demand.
Squawk Box just (May 20) had an analyst on who said that gasoline will inevitably be $12-$15/barrel before it goes down (because of conservation and the rise of renewable fuels). I hope it doesn't go above $8-$10/barrel.
Here is what T. Boone Pickens just had to say.
Background: Pickens made a TON of money in oil. He just bought $2B worth of wind turbines, and wants the US to move to natural gas as a transportation fuel in the short term, until we can be mostly renewable fuels for transportation.
In the past, many guys have said Pickens is just working the doom and gloom to drive oil prices up to make more $. But, as you can see, he has basically abandoned oil as a long-term investment.
cliff
YIP
UAL:
The 1st problem that UAL had, was that their Strategic Plan, approved by an idiot judge, to get out of their former CH11 bankruptcy was based on $50/barrell of oil. The people who made the plan, and the judge who approved it were not realistic at all. Since coming out of bankruptcy, all their CEO has been thinking about was merging, when he should've update their strategic plan for very expensive oil.
Oil/Gasoline Pricing:
I believe that the amount of speculation, and weak US dollar in the current price are both negligible. It's all about supply and demand.
Squawk Box just (May 20) had an analyst on who said that gasoline will inevitably be $12-$15/barrel before it goes down (because of conservation and the rise of renewable fuels). I hope it doesn't go above $8-$10/barrel.
Here is what T. Boone Pickens just had to say.
Background: Pickens made a TON of money in oil. He just bought $2B worth of wind turbines, and wants the US to move to natural gas as a transportation fuel in the short term, until we can be mostly renewable fuels for transportation.
In the past, many guys have said Pickens is just working the doom and gloom to drive oil prices up to make more $. But, as you can see, he has basically abandoned oil as a long-term investment.
3.2007
DOHA, Qatar: Legendary Texas oilman T. Boone Pickens sees today's stubbornly high oil price as evidence that daily global production capacity is at — or very near — its peak.
If demand for crude oil rises beyond the current global output of roughly 85 million barrels per day, Pickens told The Associated Press, prices will rise to compensate and alternative sources of energy will begin to replace petroleum.
"If I'm right, we're already at the peak," Pickens said earlier this week in Doha, on the sidelines of the Forbes magazine CEO conference. "The price will have to go up."
5.20.2008
DOHA, Qatar: Legendary Texas oilman T. Boone Pickens sees today's stubbornly high oil price as evidence that daily global production capacity is at — or very near — its peak.
If demand for crude oil rises beyond the current global output of roughly 85 million barrels per day, Pickens told The Associated Press, prices will rise to compensate and alternative sources of energy will begin to replace petroleum.
"If I'm right, we're already at the peak," Pickens said earlier this week in Doha, on the sidelines of the Forbes magazine CEO conference. "The price will have to go up."
5.20.2008
"Eighty-five million barrels of oil a day is all the world can produce, and the demand is 87 million," he said. "It's just that simple. It doesn't have anything to do with the value of the dollar."
He expects the price of a barrel of oil to reach $150 this year, and he insists speculation has nothing to do with it.
Buying oil is draining an enormous amount of money from the United States, he says.
"We are now paying out...an estimated $600 billion a year for oil," he said. "It's four times the cost of the Iraqi war, and not one of the politicians running for president has anything to say about it. I don't know whether they don't know it, or they don't want to mention it."
Pickens says natural gas is the only American resource that can reduce oil imports. He claims the effective use of natural gas could reduce oil imports by 40 percent. He dismissed ethanol as an alternative. He added that what reduced demand there has been in the United States has immediately been picked up by China.
"The only way I see that oil doesn't continue to rise [is] if we had a global recession." he said. "That will happen at some point, but I don't see the Chinese stumbling until after the Olympics."
He expects the price of a barrel of oil to reach $150 this year, and he insists speculation has nothing to do with it.
Buying oil is draining an enormous amount of money from the United States, he says.
"We are now paying out...an estimated $600 billion a year for oil," he said. "It's four times the cost of the Iraqi war, and not one of the politicians running for president has anything to say about it. I don't know whether they don't know it, or they don't want to mention it."
Pickens says natural gas is the only American resource that can reduce oil imports. He claims the effective use of natural gas could reduce oil imports by 40 percent. He dismissed ethanol as an alternative. He added that what reduced demand there has been in the United States has immediately been picked up by China.
"The only way I see that oil doesn't continue to rise [is] if we had a global recession." he said. "That will happen at some point, but I don't see the Chinese stumbling until after the Olympics."
YIP
05-23-2008, 01:26 PM
#36
Line Holder
Joined APC: Apr 2007
Posts: 46
05-23-2008, 01:37 PM
#37
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Position: On the corner, covered in Stickum
Posts: 376
Most independents pay retail for fuel.
05-23-2008, 01:52 PM
#38
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: CL-65 captain
Posts: 2,244
Apparently, after a SWA stockholders meeting (attended by a SWA captain friend) it is being thought that UAL isn't long for this world. Some are salivating over the potential for UAL going belly up and increasing others' market share.
I am still in a regional who relies on UAL for 1/2 of our flying. I am being advised by some to consider taking my chances with Comair or another carrier that doesn't rely on UAL.
What do you think?
I am still in a regional who relies on UAL for 1/2 of our flying. I am being advised by some to consider taking my chances with Comair or another carrier that doesn't rely on UAL.
What do you think?
30 years ago you would have killed for a job at Eastern or Pan Am. You would have probably left FedEx to go to one of those jobs......
and lets not forget this was a SWA management/shareholder meeting.....Hey guy, pump more money into us because UAL is going to be belly up in a few months and out market share/stock price will double.....(management knows thats not the case but sure as hell wants you to buy their stock)
05-23-2008, 02:01 PM
#39
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2007
Position: CRJ
Posts: 2,356
just like there is no way braniff, eastern, western, pan am, twa, etc etc would have ever gone out of business.
anyone who thinks that just because ual has good bases and good routes will not go away have forgotten how big these other airlines where in their hay day.
like the guy above me said people would have left fedex or even delta to get on with eastern or pan am. look at the st louis airport. things were booming so much there that they knocked down a bunch of houses to put in a runway that doesn't even get used now. look at kansas city and pit.
no one knows who will be around for the long haul, but i can tell you that NO ONE is good to go for sure.
anyone who thinks that just because ual has good bases and good routes will not go away have forgotten how big these other airlines where in their hay day.
like the guy above me said people would have left fedex or even delta to get on with eastern or pan am. look at the st louis airport. things were booming so much there that they knocked down a bunch of houses to put in a runway that doesn't even get used now. look at kansas city and pit.
no one knows who will be around for the long haul, but i can tell you that NO ONE is good to go for sure.
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