joshua

Just wondering, in all of the new hiring today, how long do you think it would take to go from a new hire to a 777-200LR/ER on DAL? (F/O of course)

Thanks all, and sorry if this has been discussed before.

DelDah Capt

A quick check of the projected seniority list following the most recent AE bid shows the junior 777 F/O in ATL is around the 6200 mark of the seniority list. In NYC, the junior 777 F/O is at a similar point on the list around the 6000 mark ( the ATL category is much larger than NYC at approx 175 F/Os versus 35, but both will grow as we add airframes). I believe that the latest batch of new hires are joining the list at around #7200, about a thousand numbers away from the junior 777 F/O. I would imagine that with the 777 fleet growth, it wouldn't be surprising if a pilot getting hired today could pick up a 777 slot within a year or two. However, it should be noted that the ATL F/O list has a significant amount of pilots with a seniority from #300 through #2000. There are also a large amount in thee 3000-4000 range. My point is that guys/gals in the 6000-7000 range who get the 777 are really kind of out of seniority and will be on reserve for a long time as pilots come in above them

joshua

Thanks for the info! What is everyone really "wanting" right now? 777 or do most of them prefer domestic?

80ktsClamp

It varies widely from person to person.

Money, schedule, the trips themselves, seniority in category.

Tomcat

I'm flying the 757/767 out of LAX and have taken a down-bid to the new LAX737 catagory. I will make around $2-3/hr less but will be a very senior line holder. I most likely will make up the pay difference with my added seniority. The point is that we all have different priorities at different times. For now, I want to be able to chose my schedule, picking what trip I want to fly on what day. If you go to the 777 the first opportunity, you will be on reserve for years. If you live around NYC that may not be such a bad thing. I believe that on International Short Call your available for 24 hours. Someone please correct me if I'm wrong.

Overall, our catogory list is very stratisfied, meaning that you have very senior pilots flying every catagory, every base, then the same thing with the junior pilots. There just is not that big of pay difference, unless your comparing Captains to FO's.

V/R, Tomcat

Jack Bauer

Tomcat, do you mind if I ask your date of hire? What where will you bid on the 737? Thanks.

joshua

Thanks for your response. It's not really about the money, it is just something I would be interested in doing. I do live near ATL, however, and I think there are a good many international flights that leave out of there. What year were you hired, if you don't mind me asking?

slinky

There are just some strange looking seniorty bubbles on all categories at DAL. Many guys/gals are sitting senior on junior equipment for QOL. This causes occasionally wierd situations based on location where you may have a higher relative seniority in senior equipment at a particular base.

ATL is very senior in all categories
NYC and LAX are typically more junior, but get senior quick at a % of the catagory.

Basically, as a newhire, you should just look at where you want to be based and pick the aircraft that either gives you the best realtive seniority, if you want a line. If you want to sit reserve, pick the aircraft that has the type of flying or layovers you like. It may be to your benefit, if you commute, to pick a different base if you can hold a line there. In my opinion, life as a commuter QOL and line holder are the same thing. I will always choose the aircraft that gives me the best relative seniority so as to make my commute easier.

slinky

Herkflyr

Also, as one 777 friend of mine once put it, "At DAL, the 777 is the greatest airplane you will never fly."

Currently we only have 9 777s (and we just got our 9th) with a 10th coming soon. With just a handful of exceptions, ALL 777 flying is > 12 hours block. That means you have four pilots all the time. That means that two of the pilots don't get a takeoff or landing. Since there are two captains and two F/Os, care to guess which two those might be? Most 777 guys go to the sim every 90 days for their required takeoffs and landings.

Also, our current city-set is limited to Asia and not very glamorous: Tel Aviv, Dubai, Tokyo, Seoul, Bombay, and soon, Shanghai. And since we have so few 777s, we can't run daily service: therefore for some of these cities the layovers can run 2, 3, even 4 or 5 days. While going to DXB might be glamorous the first time or two, after you've seen your 7th or 8th 96 hour layover, the glamor fades fast.

That said, we have a great crew rest module above the business class section: two enclosed horizontal bunks AND two business class seats, complete with sink and even a dumb waiter for the FAs to send your meals to you! If you like "dozing for dollars" this might be the life for you. Also, as we get more 777s, Europe and South America might once more be in the 777 bid package, so hopefully there will be more variety in the future.

And if you get the 777 in your first few years, expect to be junior for a VERY long time. I have been at DAL for 11+ years, and only in the past few months could I hold the aircraft even as the plug. Some of the senior FOs could be senior captains on the 767--that is how much they like to "homestead" and enjoy their seniority.

joshua

Would either of you reccommend this over int.'l flying at NJI in the GIV/V/550?

How long do you think it would take for a new hire to even look at the possibility of getting reserve on the 777-200LR? Also, are you saying that there are a lot who are not moving to captain simply to keep a good schedule and a fair amount of time at home?