Freightpuppy

Dude....couldn't agree with ya more.

vagabond

On the face of it, yes, there was at least one tort: negligence, or failure to exercise due care. When a person fails to exercise the care that a reasonable, prudent person would exercise under the same circumstances, that person is said to be negligent. This situation is still in its infancy and there are a lot of variables that we don't even know about right now. More than likely, there will be a settlement because it's cheaper and both sides have weak and strong points. As a judge, my preference is to have parties settle, but if there is to be a trial, then bring it on and get it over with.

Like any profession, one scumbag lawyer makes the rest of us look bad, just like one incompetent, unprofessional and callous pilot makes the rest of you look bad. And don't forget that most lawsuits are brought about because the family wants to pursue it, not the lawyer.

If this woman had been your mother, sister or aunt, you probably would be on the phone to the next scumbag lawyer yourself. For anyone to say otherwise would be disingenuous. The system is the way it is, and if you don't like it, try to do something constructive to change it instead of spouting off on anonymous internet boards.

Note: My use of "you" here is not intended specifically towards anyone.

Freightpuppy

There are some (a few) people left in this world that don't feel millions of dollars make everything better and would not be.

stinsonjr

I think in some ways the decision to proceed was justified. As the previous poster said, if the woman had family in NYC and her body is dumped in MIA where she potentially had no relatives...then is that the humane thing to do for the family? You could have had them called, but that would have been a travesty as well "hi, are you soandso? You mom/sister/daughter perished in route to NYC - what should we do? Bring her home? Drop her in Miami?"

Les Abend wrote an interesting article in Flying a month or so ago about having to play Doctor while commanding an aircraft. This is not a position I hope to ever find myself in - or any of you for that matter. Tragic all the way around. I usually have little good to say about AA (I fly them on biz alot) - but I will say that a crew from MIA to DFW one day did an exceptional job of caring for a very injured woman who did not speak english. The FA's exhibited a real sense of compassion with her and I would doubt that any of the crew in question would blatently try to withhold care or comfort - just my opinion. Until hard news comes out I will give the crew the benefit of the doubt.

OldAg84

Ah, Freightpuppy we have had this discussion before (SWA-Midway).

IF the tanks and other equipment didn't work, IF they delayed 02, and IF they delayed diversion, the family has a right to recover. Based on the woman's publicly published health status, probably not much.

Difficulty breathing and diabetic conditions are serious. I'm curious to know how long the episode lasted from start to her death. Was 5-10 minutes or an hour?

Lawsuits can clearly be abused, it is an imperfect system. The bar for entry is set very low and this causes financial settlements to be the best option. That's not really justice, but it is the way the system works some of the time.

I would caution anyone to put themselves in the position of being wronged and then emphatically saying, "I'll never get an attorney, they're all #@&*^'s!
If in your line of work, somebody screws up and you pay the price, say, losing your career and income, you'll just walk away and say, "well these things happen". I don't think so.

I was thinking this morning. The ironic thing is the airline business is, overall, the most safety driven business. Ice- deice or don't fly- either way it costs. MEL's, etc. Don't fly, it costs. It is also probably one of the few business where the marketplace drove the mindset, and was not driven by lawsuits (although obviously they happen).

Finally, my spouse is an attorney. She hasn't practiced in 15 years (in part becuase she was dissapointed in the system). But she has been handy to have around when we've been screwed by auto dealers, etc. And I actually find her to be fairly helpful and pleasant, not the blanket appelation assigened previously in this thread. Well, perhaps I think all pilots are..... Nah, can't say it, I'm kind of a guest here. You get my point.

Finally, nobody likes attorneys until they need one. Then they want the best.

kronan

"Airline spokesman Charley Wilson said Desir's cousin flagged down a flight attendant and said Desir had diabetes and needed oxygen. "The flight attendant responded, 'OK, but we usually don't need to treat diabetes with oxygen, but let me check anyway and get back to you,'" Wilson said."

And the Doc involved released a statement through his lawyer....so 1 Doc, 2 EMTs....and the FAs/Capt are to blame, or at least will be if the family decides to sue. But, the plane was 45 minutes from Miami and she died enroute, it's not like the Capt could have put it into superspeed mode to get there.

And shoot, I can also see her family suing AMR for failing to transport her to NY if they had landed at MIA vs canx the divert. Anybody know if the contract of carriage even mentions the requirement to be alive?


http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080226/...s/flight_death

ewrbasedpilot

Maybe it's time the airlines had an "airline bill of rights":

1. When we ask you to do something we mean it:

"We asked you to turn off your cellphone/bose headset when we closed the door five minutes ago. Please remove your personal items and deplane. You won't be going with us today. If you can't respect our regulations on the ground, we couldn't expect you to listen to us in an emergency".

2. When the seatbelt sign is on, it means STAY IN YOUR SEAT, not get up and move around when you feel like it. First offense: $100 fine, second offense, $500 fine and removal from transportation on our airline in the future.

3. Your medical problems are not ours. Any medical condition that requires special assistance or a divert will be billed to you or your insurance company along with ALL associated costs. Our airline cannot afford to ensure your health problems become ours.

4. We are NOT responsible for WX delays or air traffic delays. If you are inconvenienced, it's not our fault. Please take the bus or train.

5. If you are booked on a flight and don't show up, there's a $200 fee to cover the cost of the seat going empty. We no longer overbook so you can't get bumped. So we don't lose the cost of the seat sold to you, we have to be able to recover from this situation. If you'd prefer to relinquish your ticket at its purchase price, that will work also.

6. We are not in the janitorial business, so if you make a mess of your seating area, a $50 surcharge will be tacked onto your credit card for having the area cleaned.

Ahhhh........wouldn't this sure get some peoples attention????

ewrbasedpilot

Sad, but yes. When you have 200 other passengers who are depending on you to get them somewhere, you have to respect their wishes too. What if someone on the plane was going to see their loved one before they shipped off to Iraq and being delayed for three hours because of a diverted plane caused them to never see them again, how would you feel? What if a million dollar business deal was waiting for you and you COULDN'T be late or that would be the downfall of the deal, how would you feel? The bottom line is that you have to do what's best for EVERYONE involved, not just one person. I know it sounds cold, but believe me, the families attorney's certainly won't care how cold or callous they are in the lawsuit when they start attacking everyone.

cma2407

I take it you're not the head of customer service. Do this, and the free fall of the airline industry will be complete. It'll make taking the Greyhound seem like a trip on the Queen Mary.

ewrbasedpilot

Start watching how fast airlines are cancelling their flights whenever ANY weather starts building. Airlines are not going to put up with "passengers taking them to the cleaners" any more. Instead of delaying flights, they now cancel them so they don't have to pay out outrageous compensation for something they have no control over. Rather than take a chance on leaving and hopefully getting some passengers to their destinations, they just pre-cancel and save the headaches. You see, passengers thought they were "on to something" with the bill of rights. Now, they just don't get to go anywhere......... What's that saying......"don't wish too hard for something or you just might get it". Well, they got it and THEY are the ones who got screwed, not the airlines. Oh well............