APU fuel burn does not matter
03-16-2022, 03:53 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Position: On the hotel shuttle
Posts: 5,931
If they company were honestly concerned about APU fuel savings, they would invest in better training of ground personnel on how to hook up the air, install devices to prevent kinking, and invest in the maintenance of your units. The vast majority of ground AC units are completely inadequate. On a sunny day, even if temps are in the 50s, the cabin can quickly get into the 80s.
I've gotten to plenty of aircraft over the years where the APU was running all night. When I asked Ops they stated that MX gets the airplane ready an hour or two before push. The 737 that spends the night in KIN has its APU running all night -- no ground power.
If they want to cut back on APU usage, they can fix these problems first.
03-16-2022, 04:09 AM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,777
There are only an handful of ground air units that I've seen that can adequately cool a cabin with passengers onboard. In general, if it's warm out I'll get the APU going as soon as we start to board.
03-16-2022, 04:10 AM
#23
That/It/Thang
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,940
Comfort. It really doesn’t get more difficult than that. Pilots saying “10 more minutes to save a buck”, while passengers are hot, is a huge disservice.
03-16-2022, 04:10 AM
#24
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Joined APC: Jul 2013
Posts: 10,560
And plenty of units blow warm air into an already warm cabin. The thermostats simply don't work. By the time someone answers on the radio, sends someone out to adjust (if they can) it's time to -- start the APU.
I've gotten to plenty of aircraft over the years where the APU was running all night. When I asked Ops they stated that MX gets the airplane ready an hour or two before push. The 737 that spends the night in KIN has its APU running all night -- no ground power.
If they want to cut back on APU usage, they can fix these problems first.
I've gotten to plenty of aircraft over the years where the APU was running all night. When I asked Ops they stated that MX gets the airplane ready an hour or two before push. The 737 that spends the night in KIN has its APU running all night -- no ground power.
If they want to cut back on APU usage, they can fix these problems first.
03-16-2022, 04:14 AM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 1,777
These threads pop up every spring, and it's always easy to tell who doesn't spend a lot of time sitting in the back.
03-16-2022, 05:03 AM
#26
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Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 6,785
You are a pilot, not a ground ops technician. It’s far from “blindly turning on the APU,” it’s the simple acknowledgment of “I’m hot, they are probably hot, need cool air”.
Comfort. It really doesn’t get more difficult than that. Pilots saying “10 more minutes to save a buck”, while passengers are hot, is a huge disservice.
Comfort. It really doesn’t get more difficult than that. Pilots saying “10 more minutes to save a buck”, while passengers are hot, is a huge disservice.
03-16-2022, 05:23 AM
#27
That/It/Thang
Joined APC: Aug 2020
Posts: 2,940
i agree. But I also recognize that my (and my passengers’) comfort often doesn’t require the APU. If we can save fuel and money, we should. If comfort dictates starting the APU, we should. That’s all covered in my FOM, and probably yours. Pretending that $90 per flight doesn’t matter is idiotic
And it isn’t $90 per flight. Stop being simple with the math. You have to run the APU regardless, you’re starting it at the start of boarding vs 10-20 prior to push, you’re not accounting for the loads of cash wasted on ground crew hooking and unhooking air carts that don’t work, the extra run time an APU must run to cool down a hot airplane receiving hot jet bridge air, maintenance on the jet bridge air, etc. To say it’s $90 a flight to cool the plane down a little earlier is idiotic
03-16-2022, 06:18 AM
#28
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Joined APC: Sep 2016
Posts: 6,785
And nobody in here stated that the APU should be started if there isn’t a necessity to start it. Nobody advocated wasting fuel “just because,” this entire thread has been about maintaining comfort over the small savings per flight.
And it isn’t $90 per flight. Stop being simple with the math. You have to run the APU regardless, you’re starting it at the start of boarding vs 10-20 prior to push, you’re not accounting for the loads of cash wasted on ground crew hooking and unhooking air carts that don’t work, the extra run time an APU must run to cool down a hot airplane receiving hot jet bridge air, maintenance on the jet bridge air, etc. To say it’s $90 a flight to cool the plane down a little earlier is idiotic
And it isn’t $90 per flight. Stop being simple with the math. You have to run the APU regardless, you’re starting it at the start of boarding vs 10-20 prior to push, you’re not accounting for the loads of cash wasted on ground crew hooking and unhooking air carts that don’t work, the extra run time an APU must run to cool down a hot airplane receiving hot jet bridge air, maintenance on the jet bridge air, etc. To say it’s $90 a flight to cool the plane down a little earlier is idiotic
03-16-2022, 06:27 AM
#29
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2010
Posts: 2,354
OOfff are you intentionally being obtuse? No one is saying to waste money. This thread was for the people who feel guilty about running the APU because the company has scared them into thinking the APU is a large operating cost... It is not. If any crew even has doubts about the temperature in the back, starting the APU is most likely a good idea. It takes time for the APU to actually cool a boarding plane, so if you wait until it reaches the upper limit of passenger comfort, you started it too late. In my experience, the APU is needed to cool the cabin on the majority of flights. Even in the winter, sometimes they blast the hot ground air and they take so long to disconnect the air, that now I need to start the APU to undo that mistake.
03-16-2022, 06:43 AM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2019
Posts: 144
i agree. But I also recognize that my (and my passengers’) comfort often doesn’t require the APU. If we can save fuel and money, we should. If comfort dictates starting the APU, we should. That’s all covered in my FOM, and probably yours. Pretending that $90 per flight doesn’t matter is idiotic
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