VIRGINS PAY AND MONTHLT GUAR. announced
06-09-2007, 12:37 PM
#11
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: NU Guy
Posts: 437
Scenario #3
There is a pig named Charles. He is having trouble jumping a fence. He meets a fairy named Priscilla. He can't decide whether to wish to become an animal that can jump the fence, or to magically get some wings. As luck would have it, after choosing wings, he is slaughtered.
Maybe if he had gotten another 3 hours of sleep the night before (instead he was kept up by the goats in the pasture next door banging all night), he wouldn't have made such a dreadful mistake.
There is a pig named Charles. He is having trouble jumping a fence. He meets a fairy named Priscilla. He can't decide whether to wish to become an animal that can jump the fence, or to magically get some wings. As luck would have it, after choosing wings, he is slaughtered.
Maybe if he had gotten another 3 hours of sleep the night before (instead he was kept up by the goats in the pasture next door banging all night), he wouldn't have made such a dreadful mistake.
06-09-2007, 03:32 PM
#13
Banned
Joined APC: Oct 2006
Position: DHC-8 F/O
Posts: 142
06-09-2007, 05:57 PM
#14
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Position: Formerly Avantair
Posts: 198
Another way to look at it:
The moron that can't hold a heading or altitude to save his/her life has their number come up for upgrade. This person is also unable to think for themselves when the situation changes and could not navigate their way out of a wet paper bag. The company spends the time and money getting them ready for their check ride, but they can't pass it after 2 attempts. So after all that wasted effort, our hero is now a right seater, again.
Now the training starts for the next person one number lower.
No matter what light you shine on it, both systems of upgrade have their pitfalls and benefits.
The moron that can't hold a heading or altitude to save his/her life has their number come up for upgrade. This person is also unable to think for themselves when the situation changes and could not navigate their way out of a wet paper bag. The company spends the time and money getting them ready for their check ride, but they can't pass it after 2 attempts. So after all that wasted effort, our hero is now a right seater, again.
Now the training starts for the next person one number lower.
No matter what light you shine on it, both systems of upgrade have their pitfalls and benefits.
06-10-2007, 06:39 AM
#15
Guest
Posts: n/a
Geronimo... That is all true, I see it all to often at the airline I am with. I have two replies... First, anyone who performs that poorly in an airplane has no business in the right seat either, after all... they are supposed to be able to assume command should the PIC become incapacitated right? At Virgin America they are presently looking for people with high time and a type in the A320... one would hope this type of person can fly an airplane.
06-10-2007, 07:43 AM
#16
Line Holder
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 320A
Posts: 77
06-10-2007, 01:39 PM
#17
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,233
Another way to look at it:
The moron that can't hold a heading or altitude to save his/her life has their number come up for upgrade. This person is also unable to think for themselves when the situation changes and could not navigate their way out of a wet paper bag. The company spends the time and money getting them ready for their check ride, but they can't pass it after 2 attempts. So after all that wasted effort, our hero is now a right seater, again.
Now the training starts for the next person one number lower.
No matter what light you shine on it, both systems of upgrade have their pitfalls and benefits.
The moron that can't hold a heading or altitude to save his/her life has their number come up for upgrade. This person is also unable to think for themselves when the situation changes and could not navigate their way out of a wet paper bag. The company spends the time and money getting them ready for their check ride, but they can't pass it after 2 attempts. So after all that wasted effort, our hero is now a right seater, again.
Now the training starts for the next person one number lower.
No matter what light you shine on it, both systems of upgrade have their pitfalls and benefits.
06-10-2007, 02:16 PM
#18
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,838
Another way to look at it:
The moron that can't hold a heading or altitude to save his/her life has their number come up for upgrade. This person is also unable to think for themselves when the situation changes and could not navigate their way out of a wet paper bag. The company spends the time and money getting them ready for their check ride, but they can't pass it after 2 attempts. So after all that wasted effort, our hero is now a right seater, again.
Now the training starts for the next person one number lower.
No matter what light you shine on it, both systems of upgrade have their pitfalls and benefits.
The moron that can't hold a heading or altitude to save his/her life has their number come up for upgrade. This person is also unable to think for themselves when the situation changes and could not navigate their way out of a wet paper bag. The company spends the time and money getting them ready for their check ride, but they can't pass it after 2 attempts. So after all that wasted effort, our hero is now a right seater, again.
Now the training starts for the next person one number lower.
No matter what light you shine on it, both systems of upgrade have their pitfalls and benefits.
And yet another way to look at it.............
How would such a "Moron" as you put it get hired as a Professional Pilot in the first place? Don't they have standards? Don't they give pre hire Sim checks?
Most Airlines don't hire First Officers anyway..........they Hire Future Captains!
Even if a "Moron" as you put it somehow manages to skirt the system getting hired as an FO, when his seniority allows him/her to upgrade, that "Moron" will still have to pass an FAA oral, still have to pass an FAA type Ride and still have to pass an FAA IOE/Line Check sign off. And every 6 months that Moron will have to prove to the FAA that him or herself is worthy to be there.
06-11-2007, 06:10 AM
#19
Guest
Posts: n/a
And yet another way to look at it.............
How would such a "Moron" as you put it get hired as a Professional Pilot in the first place? Don't they have standards? Don't they give pre hire Sim checks?
Most Airlines don't hire First Officers anyway..........they Hire Future Captains!
Even if a "Moron" as you put it somehow manages to skirt the system getting hired as an FO, when his seniority allows him/her to upgrade, that "Moron" will still have to pass an FAA oral, still have to pass an FAA type Ride and still have to pass an FAA IOE/Line Check sign off. And every 6 months that Moron will have to prove to the FAA that him or herself is worthy to be there.
How would such a "Moron" as you put it get hired as a Professional Pilot in the first place? Don't they have standards? Don't they give pre hire Sim checks?
Most Airlines don't hire First Officers anyway..........they Hire Future Captains!
Even if a "Moron" as you put it somehow manages to skirt the system getting hired as an FO, when his seniority allows him/her to upgrade, that "Moron" will still have to pass an FAA oral, still have to pass an FAA type Ride and still have to pass an FAA IOE/Line Check sign off. And every 6 months that Moron will have to prove to the FAA that him or herself is worthy to be there.
06-11-2007, 10:14 AM
#20
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Posts: 2,838
I think Geronimos point was the "moron"'s number will be up for upgrade possibly for the second or third time, and it is a waste of the airlines time and money to put them through training again only to have to return to the right seat. *...........................................
And my point is How did this person get hired in the first place?
Not by merit obviously..........................He/she got hired because of who they knew or who they were in bed with.
That is why Seniority based upgrades are the norm in the industry. It takes away the polictics and WHO you KNOW to get ahead. It has worked well for years.
Do a few slip through the cracks? Yeap but that happens with any system, but most are sifted out with the bi-annual checkrides and no notice line checks.
Part -121 Capts must meet certain performance and Medical standards (as do FO's) The minimum, standard is good enough. While I'll agree that most of the folks I fly with are above Minimum standards........
........."if the Minimums weren't the Minimums, we wouldn't have minimums!" Famous Navy flyer
