Test pilot at center of 737 Max...

Reply Subscribe

Page 2 of 7

Last »

Thread Tools

Search this Thread

08-10-2020, 12:17 AM

#11

tallpilot

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Dec 2011

Position: A320 FO

Posts: 976

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9mikemike

unfortunate that the gross incompetence of the pilots which is the only reason those jets crashed is not being held up as the number one problem....Like everything else- blame someone else....

Little doubt better trained pilots would have understood what was happening sooner and reacted appropriately. That doesn't absolve Boeing. They pushed the common type rating way too far to save airlines a few bucks on training. They offered the second AoA as an option to squeeze a little more money out of each airframe to make Wall Street happy. They massively increased the authority of the system without a proper risk review and lied to regulators on multiple occasions. It's more than enough evidence to prove an absolute failure of safety culture.

This on top of the fact that they seem to have forgotten how to shop vac up the metal shavings from drilling holes before running wiring harnesses through the mess on every single production line they run. It's an absolute embarrassment on all counts.

Forkner damned himself with his own words. It's pretty easy to 'railroad' a guy when he leaves a signed confession.

08-10-2020, 04:41 AM

#12

HulkaBurger

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Dec 2017

Posts: 381

Quote:

Originally Posted by tallpilot

Forkner damned himself with his own words. It's pretty easy to 'railroad' a guy when he leaves a signed confession.

Precisely!

08-10-2020, 06:21 AM

#13

rickair7777

Prime Minister/Moderator

Joined APC: Jan 2006

Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim

Posts: 40,016

Quote:

Originally Posted by captive apple

Forkner is being railroaded in the great tradition of power and money.

Sounds more like he was a willing henchman of power and money. The paper-trail is not very absolving.

The early out was probably a blessing for him, this might even have caught up with at SWA, even off probation. He'll be lucky to get a job at a regional someday.

08-10-2020, 06:58 AM

#14

busdriver12

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Nov 2013

Posts: 2,756

Quote:

Originally Posted by 9mikemike

unfortunate that the gross incompetence of the pilots which is the only reason those jets crashed is not being held up as the number one problem....Like everything else- blame someone else....

I thought they put 737 test pilots in the sim, gave them the same situation, they knew it was coming and they still crashed. Is that incorrect?

08-10-2020, 07:34 AM

#15

Duckdude

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Aug 2010

Position: N/A

Posts: 607

Quote:

Originally Posted by busdriver12

I thought they put 737 test pilots in the sim, gave them the same situation, they knew it was coming and they still crashed. Is that incorrect?

I don’t buy that. Wouldn’t any pilot that knew it was coming just disconnect the trim the second it started running uncommanded and trim manually until landing?

08-10-2020, 07:41 AM

#16

Otterbox

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Oct 2015

Position: Gear slinger

Posts: 2,958

Quote:

Originally Posted by captive apple

Forkner is being railroaded in the great tradition of power and money.

Maybe, but theres also the appearance is that guy talked federal regulators out of additional training requirements on behalf of Southwest Airlines in exchange for a job at that company.

With cherry picked emails talking about “Jedi mind tricked” and “lied to”, the optics are dicey at best.

08-10-2020, 07:47 AM

#17

Downtime

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: May 2020

Posts: 484

Quote:

Originally Posted by Otterbox

Here is the thing that email may bite hard. The rods lied to and Jedi mind trick and email about talking to federal regulators Is never good. It would not surprise me if the FBI ends up paying him a visit. Lying to the feds is a great way to get up to 5 years per count and the FBI loves electronic communications they can hold onto forever.

08-10-2020, 09:23 AM

#18

firefighterplt

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Mar 2020

Posts: 399

Quote:

Originally Posted by Downtime

If the fed bois show up at your door, they already have everything they need for their case.

Could the FAA pursue certificate action? Doesn’t the ATP require ‘good moral character’ or some similar wording?

08-10-2020, 09:59 AM

#19

Downtime

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: May 2020

Posts: 484

Quote:

Originally Posted by firefighterplt

Yeah possibly I really don’t know if there is much precedent for enforcement based on that. I do know though there was a car in which a guy made up flight time in his log book and his flight school turned him in. He then lied to the FAA and the FAA referred the case to the DOJ. The DOJ took and and arrested the pilot.

08-10-2020, 11:12 AM

#20

tallpilot

Gets Weekends Off

Joined APC: Dec 2011

Position: A320 FO

Posts: 976

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duckdude

I don’t buy that. Wouldn’t any pilot that knew it was coming just disconnect the trim the second it started running uncommanded and trim manually until landing?

I agree. Perhaps they were placed in the high speed dive with the trim already full nose down? That would unrecoverable below a given altitude regardless of skill and preparation.

Silly test though, the idea is to use airmanship to avoid unrecoverable situations.