atooraya

Everyone just stop reading right here. Quick search sends you to the M3 LR AWD with 353 mile range.
https://www.tesla.com/model3


The Lucid Air is coming out with a 406 mile range. Every auto manufacturer is coming out with a lineup of EVs in the next few years. They’re all idiots though. Let’s burn some coal!

Gunfighter

I never fully appreciated what that statement meant until after owning a Tesla for a few months. I used to waste so much time fueling, waiting in line for fuel (Costco) or just plain interrupting my drive to get fuel. Driving an electric is like having your own personal fuel butler in the garage. Wireless vehicle charging will even eliminate that 8 second interruption.

Taxes
WRT taxes, electric vehicles currently benefit from road taxes paid on fossil fuels. I can see where annual mileage taxes replace both state and federal fuel taxes. There will be too much pushback for an electricity tax, since most of it is used for purposes other than driving on roads. Discriminating between transportation usage of electricity vs other usage is problematic and will drive us toward an annual mileage tax or increased vehicle registration costs. The idea of subway riding city dwellers subsidizing roads via an electricity tax is dead in the water.

Current federal fuel taxes are around 1 cent per mile (18 cents per gallon). State taxes vary from 8 to 50 cents per gallon, but figure roughly double the federal tax. Between state and federal fuel taxes, consumers are paying 3 cents per mile or $3 per 100 miles. 100 miles worth of electricity ranges from 25-35kWh across the Tesla offerings. Using 30 kWh for simplicity sake, a tax of 10 cents per kWh (on transportation electricity) would generate the same $3 in taxes. This is almost as much as the cost of the electricity. We must pay for our roads, its just a matter of determining the best way.

I'm sure our elected representatives will be in favor of whichever method grants them more power and influence vs what is in the best interest of the constituency. Stand by for pet project funding...

galaxy flyer

How does that work 270 miles into 540 mile day’s drive. Oh, you drive in 270 mile increments. How does the EV charge at -8F or drive at that temp? I got your math, except, as pointed out, you need to remove taxes from the gas equation to compare the two and I get about 30mpg better at less than 80mph. Add in my car is paid for, so no capital cost, I can fuel for a decade before I’d come close break even.

I don’t now where you live, but waiting for gas is unknown here. If I spend 2 minutes at a fuel island mid-way on a trip, I watching the flowers grow. If I spend 5 minutes at station, the line’s too long for coffee, I’m leaving.

Profane Kahuna

So when you said:

Who exactly did you mean?

Seneca Pilot

You are correct, my mistake. There will be no taxes added to electricity as EVs take over in the coming years even though the government is known for grabbing for every cent they can collect. EVs will continue to not only receive tax rebates for purchasers but will be allowed to continue to run the roads with no taxes paid by their owners to maintain them. There will be no increase in electric costs over the nest ten years although demand for electricity for charging vehicles will cause a need for production to explode in that time frame. You can ignore those unavoidable facts because I was unaware of the new range available on the three and was using the numbers available when I looked at it while purchasing my X in 2018.

Everyone just carry on in your fantasy land where you get to drive with no taxes and no increases in costs for fuel, ever.

atooraya

You must’ve been great at turns around a point because your circular reasoning is non stop. People have already pointed out that EVs pay higher registration fees. Now go back to low range of Teslas.

fcoolaiddrinker

Demand for electricity will go up. But what I think your not taking into account is production will also go up. If demand outpaces supply and prices increase more folks will just get panels and batteries increasing the supply. Eventually the free market will prevail. The taxes outside of increased registration fees are the unknown right now.

Seneca Pilot

Pete Buttigieg has suggested a mileage tax and, like you, I think that is the way it will go. We won't get to drive our EVs on the roads for long without having to pay for the maintenance, particularly since they tend to be heavier than a similar gasoline vehicle.

Seneca Pilot

The problem is that even if you only have an average of 30 to 40 miles daily that will take 8 to10 KWH at least to recharge. The average house currently uses about 30 KWH per day so you're adding a third to the electricity demand per EV for each house with one, two thirds if you have to charge two. If that happens over a relatively short period of time as is projected by the EV industry it is going to cost huge amounts of money to get there. We have had over one hundred years to get to the flimsy grid we have now. Double the demand and it falls apart. The cost will have to go up just to pay for the build out and the anti nuclear crowd is going to have to back off because solar and wind won't cut it.

I would hope we get to the point where everyone powers their own house with their own solar and battery set up but that is very expensive and needs way more adoption to become affordable to anyone but people like us in the top five percent of earners.

Seneca Pilot

The difference in registration cost goes to the state. All states don't charge an EV fee. Even when they do, only some states charge enough to equal or exceed the gas tax equivalent. None of them replace the federal gas tax. Why does every argument have to be an insult, especially when your insult is based on incorrect statements. Yes I used the mileage number for the last 3 I looked at instead of googling it. I am not sitting here all day waiting to google every fact, especially since it isn't even important to the points being made..

I never said Teslas have low range. I never argued that EVs aren't more efficient. I am saying, what seems like a fairly uncontroversial thought, that the cost of driving EVs will rise over time due to higher costs for electric and the Federal Govt. taking their pound of flesh. Our free ride will end.