APCbot

I find that hard to believe.

BurritoSupremo

So, we don't have an AIP then?

Lockheed

yes we have an AIP
an AIP is nothing more than bullet points

a TA is full language
we are close though

sky jet

He beat me to it.

We have an AIP. Agreement in Principle. Meaning the the company and the union have agreed to the items in the document but the language is still to be fleshed out.

We do not yet have a TA. Tentative Agreement. A tentative agreement is the exact language of the contract. A TA becomes a CBA if it is voted in and signed by both parties. The union and the company are still working on the final language.

BurritoSupremo

Ok, so we have bullet points for every section?

Lockheed

no
we have full language TA'd in 22 sections
and all but a few subsections of the remaining sections

i expect to have everything TA'd next week
but there still so much work to do
every single word will be read and read again by 4 or 5 different people to find all the errors that happen in this kind of process

WhaleWrangler

Lets hope that their reading comprehension is good because as we know just a missing comma or word can lead to games by the company.

There had better be changes with QOL considerations especially with CS and their fingers in our paychecks along with a few others that the survey showed, because right now an overall 3% raise, WITHOUT insurance premiums (which are going up) and inflation taken into consideration means almost zero or negative gain.

Those that think the pilots have no leverage right now are comparing us to pax carriers, we're not, we are booked to capacity now to almost year end with more aircraft arriving, making more money than than ever with most having to fly over guarantee, O/T emails keep coming. Now how do you think the company will fair if it gets voted down and crews don't cover the extra flying etc., etc.?? The pilots have more leverage than the company would like us to think and that's what they are hoping for.

Frank717

This person gets it!

Many ACMIs discourage mainline furloughed pilots from coming over (since they’ll be back to their better paying job in a few years). So why not value your current (and future) employees the same? True, we can’t go to the majors today, but things change, and when the time comes, many will pursue a better contract. This isn’t 10 years away, but 1-2. People are chomping at the bit trying to go, travel and get around. The vaccine will allow them to. So, airline travel will return.

However, the current market of “Order from home” will not change. Many people now know the convenience and ease from home shopping, they won’t give it up. Military troops still need to move and time precious cargo will need to go around the world.

Why are cargo guys so quick to sell themselves short? You have value, your company is breaking stock records. Get your fair share.

wjcandee

If I were you guys, and I admit I'm not, I would knock off all the veiled threats to as a group stop taking overtime and falsely write up maintenance issues. Unless you want this thread to be exhibit A when the company goes to get an injunction against you for an illegal job action.

People think that they're so clever in how they phrase things, and that by doing so they protect themselves. That's simply not true. In fact a judge is going to read the words probably even more harshly than they were intended.

It's not a legal form of leverage, and even if you try to say, as the American Airlines guys learned, that it's up to the individual pilot, when that message is being disseminated as a group, whether or not with official Union support, it's a job action. Read the Federal Court decision where US District Judge Joe Kendall found that the American union had violated his injunction by doing exactly this kind of stuff, and proceeded to take actions that he expressly said would cause the assets of the Union to "fit in the glove box of a Piper Cub". People think that if they don't technically say this or that that it's not an issue. It is. Because a judge is going to look at the actual effect and infer intent from the conduct, not the words used.

EDIT: Sorry, it was "overhead bin of a Piper Cub". Pilots were calling in sick and refusing to accept overtime. The union had been saying that they couldn't control the conduct of individual pilots who had an independent responsibility to determine if they were fit for duty. Kendall didn't buy it: https://www.chicagotribune.com/news/...232-story.html

CardboardCutout

^ Wisdom.
This isn't a remotely private place. So don't say things you don't want to be used in court.