JetBlue Latest and Greatest
04-14-2017, 07:23 AM
#3231
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,206
JetBlue Latest and Greatest
Or they could go fly their actual seniority if they want captain pay.
Thus the original comment(and I can't believe I'm agreeing with hyperboy) about the circumvention of seniority.
They made a choice to be In the school house and take that "paper bid upgrade". So either stay in the school house with no VDA,RSA or be a senior FO in MCO or go be a junior CA were you can hold it, but being able to circumvent seniority is what people have a problem with!
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Thus the original comment(and I can't believe I'm agreeing with hyperboy) about the circumvention of seniority.
They made a choice to be In the school house and take that "paper bid upgrade". So either stay in the school house with no VDA,RSA or be a senior FO in MCO or go be a junior CA were you can hold it, but being able to circumvent seniority is what people have a problem with!
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Again, they are very different positions. If the CBA makes the pay in line with the industry, the position will become highly desirable (like it is at most airlines), and the instructors will become more senior over time.
I don't see it as circumventing seniority. They don't bid at all, so no one is harmed. Senior pilots in MCO get 1/2 or more of their line bought every month. That's why people stay senior in the right seat so they can hold trips that instructors buy.
They make less money than a line pilot, and for that reduced income they get to be home (if they live in Orlando). Everything is a give/take. Line pilots get more money and more time off. Instructors get less money, less time off, but are home. Pick your poison.
Let's see what the new CBA brings. It could be a game changer.
04-14-2017, 07:28 AM
#3232
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,552
JetBlue Latest and Greatest
No one is talking about the buying of trips except you.
The instructor VDA and RSA reduce the size of the MCO base. FACT. The instructors act as a suede reserve for the base and the company doesn't have to properly staff the base.
That means less line pilots who want to be based there at their rightful seniority have that chance.
circumvention!!
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The instructor VDA and RSA reduce the size of the MCO base. FACT. The instructors act as a suede reserve for the base and the company doesn't have to properly staff the base.
That means less line pilots who want to be based there at their rightful seniority have that chance.
circumvention!!
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04-14-2017, 07:48 AM
#3233
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,206
JetBlue Latest and Greatest
No one is talking about the buying of trips except you.
The instructor VDA and RSA reduce the size of the MCO base. FACT. The instructors act as a suede reserve for the base and the company doesn't have to properly staff the base.
That means less line pilots who want to be based there at their rightful seniority have that chance.
circumvention!!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
The instructor VDA and RSA reduce the size of the MCO base. FACT. The instructors act as a suede reserve for the base and the company doesn't have to properly staff the base.
That means less line pilots who want to be based there at their rightful seniority have that chance.
circumvention!!
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Anyone who lives in MCO can do RSA/VDA (actually even if you don't live in MCO you can). You don't have to be an instructor to do that, do I don't really see how that's a problem with instructors. If they were all line pilots they could do the same. There's no seniority violation there.
If you don't like RSA/VDA, vote no to a CBA that contains that language.
04-14-2017, 08:04 AM
#3234
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 503
Gonna speculate on buying HA ( broken record, I know):
- New contract that I'm sure the execs at JB wouldn't mind.
- No need for an actual west coast base ( maybe LAX/LGB) because everything flows out from HNL, we just connect to the east coast.
- HA has the 330's we need to go to Europe. If it's not successful, send them back to the Pacific ( minimal risk).
- HA 321 orders are waiting for the selection of engines...to compliment JB engines?
- Keep the JB name, but Blue Hawaiian for inter island flights.
I'll wait for the phone call from the JB execs to publish more "ideas"
Last edited by Rabid Seagull; 04-14-2017 at 08:17 AM.
04-14-2017, 08:47 AM
#3235
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,552
JetBlue Latest and Greatest
Anyone who lives in MCO can do RSA/VDA (actually even if you don't live in MCO you can). You don't have to be an instructor to do that, do I don't really see how that's a problem with instructors. If they were all line pilots they could do the same. There's no seniority violation there.
If you don't like RSA/VDA, vote no to a CBA that contains that language.
If you don't like RSA/VDA, vote no to a CBA that contains that language.
Except those guys have to do their time slumming it in BOS and JFK at their rightful seniority the rest of the year. All you have do during every IROP is look at the RSA list. It's full of school house guys. The company knows they can count on our "helpers" in the house.
Justify it to yourself all you want. It's wrong that school house guys are flying the line outside of their two fly days. Period!
I hope our CBA prohibits it or changes to a true adjunct style instructor
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04-14-2017, 09:29 AM
#3236
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 2,552
Just for thought on the cba.
Instructors should be seniority list line pilots
The school house should be staffed at the same CA/FO ratio as the airline.
Instructors should be paid at their respective rates.
Instructors should go no more than 3 months in the school house before flying 1 month on the line at their respective position. (Qualifier for our seniority list guys who are out on medical)
While in the school house instructors should be prohibited from picking up open time, RSA, VDA.
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Instructors should be seniority list line pilots
The school house should be staffed at the same CA/FO ratio as the airline.
Instructors should be paid at their respective rates.
Instructors should go no more than 3 months in the school house before flying 1 month on the line at their respective position. (Qualifier for our seniority list guys who are out on medical)
While in the school house instructors should be prohibited from picking up open time, RSA, VDA.
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04-14-2017, 09:33 AM
#3237
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 1,206
JetBlue Latest and Greatest
Just for thought on the cba.
Instructors should be seniority list line pilots
The school house should be staffed at the same CA/FO ratio as the airline.
Instructors should be paid at their respective rates.
Instructors should go no more than 3 months in the school house before flying 1 month on the line at their respective position. (Qualifier for our seniority list guys who are out on medical)
While in the school house instructors should be prohibited from picking up open time, RSA, VDA.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Instructors should be seniority list line pilots
The school house should be staffed at the same CA/FO ratio as the airline.
Instructors should be paid at their respective rates.
Instructors should go no more than 3 months in the school house before flying 1 month on the line at their respective position. (Qualifier for our seniority list guys who are out on medical)
While in the school house instructors should be prohibited from picking up open time, RSA, VDA.
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
If you make the job suck, you'll get crappy instructors. No one in their right mind would be an instructor under the rules you outline above. The pay differential is already big enough. If you make it even bigger by prohibiting overtime (RSA/VDA), the training quality will suffer.
Some guys will have a big problem with being forced to bid every 3 months. How do they get Crashpads for one month out of every 3? Personally, I would've been fine with it when I was an instructor, but that's not the majority opinion.
04-14-2017, 12:03 PM
#3239
What’s it doing now?
Joined APC: Mar 2011
Position: 190CA
Posts: 726
If you make the job suck, you'll get crappy instructors. No one in their right mind would be an instructor under the rules you outline above. The pay differential is already big enough. If you make it even bigger by prohibiting overtime (RSA/VDA), the training quality will suffer.
Some guys will have a big problem with being forced to bid every 3 months. How do they get Crashpads for one month out of every 3? Personally, I would've been fine with it when I was an instructor, but that's not the majority opinion.
Some guys will have a big problem with being forced to bid every 3 months. How do they get Crashpads for one month out of every 3? Personally, I would've been fine with it when I was an instructor, but that's not the majority opinion.
04-14-2017, 12:21 PM
#3240
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2013
Position: Captain
Posts: 243
If you make the job suck, you'll get crappy instructors. No one in their right mind would be an instructor under the rules you outline above. The pay differential is already big enough. If you make it even bigger by prohibiting overtime (RSA/VDA), the training quality will suffer.
Some guys will have a big problem with being forced to bid every 3 months. How do they get Crashpads for one month out of every 3? Personally, I would've been fine with it when I was an instructor, but that's not the majority opinion.
Some guys will have a big problem with being forced to bid every 3 months. How do they get Crashpads for one month out of every 3? Personally, I would've been fine with it when I was an instructor, but that's not the majority opinion.
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