JetBlue Latest and Greatest
01-31-2021, 08:41 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2016
Posts: 369
I hate that attitude. One of the larger reasons i specifically chose JetBlue, and like it here, is because of where we fly. I talk to friends at SW all the time, and I have no desire to layover at their stations.
It's a small point, sure, especially in a pandemic when trying to keep afloat, but still, I don't want more SDQ/STI, and add in a bunch of MKE, DTW, CLE, IND, CVG...
It's a small point, sure, especially in a pandemic when trying to keep afloat, but still, I don't want more SDQ/STI, and add in a bunch of MKE, DTW, CLE, IND, CVG...
I still can't believe the MEC agreed to a potential 12 year deal (Up to 10yr option with 2yr spooldown). That's effin bananas.
01-31-2021, 08:52 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,010
Every single flight from NYC and BOS that doesn’t go to a focus city or international can be done on American Eagle, and JetBlue can make money on it via the revenue sharing, which they have yet to disclose any details of. In our two biggest bases, we only have a guaranteed ASM share of focus city to focus city, and focus city to Caribbean. No other guarantees. Oh, and a 76 seater has twice as many ASMs per block hour as a 140/162 seater.
Also, the baseline ASMs are created in 2021...they could slash the remainder of 2021 flying, put a ton on american Eagle, then our baseline from which they have to grow is even smaller than it was in 2020. Grant tons of long term EILs, and then at that point our revenue is less than 35% and we furlough in November. Oh, and it isn’t until 2025 that it even matters (2027 actually). Then what? We grieve it? So...6-7 years from now we start the legal process while Eagle does 50% of our northeast flying and we have 1500 on furlough that whole time? Is JetBlue likely to do that? Probably not. But they can with this LOA. Until LOA13 is in place, there is no revenue sharing, and JetBlue can only allow Eagle to fly B6 code, but gets no monetary benefit. They are therefore more incentivized to outsource because of the revenue share. They still get a portion of the money but incur none of the cost. Unless I’m missing something from the secret revenue sharing model.
No reps have been able to address that point for me. They just say “trust me, that won’t happen. We don’t think they will do that.” One even said “it doesn’t matter where we fly, if Eagle takes all the short stuff, we will get new longer flights because we have ASM and block hour growth requirements, and flying is flying no matter where it is.” Well...no. 1) for the reasons above, the growth metrics and their lookback/enforcement time period are atrocious, and 2) giving away some flying thinking it was in exchange for other flying is exactly how the regionals proliferated in this country.
This is opening ourselves up for massive outsourcing to Eagle, as well as putting ourselves in the middle of a whipsaw with Eagle. Don’t do it.
Also, the baseline ASMs are created in 2021...they could slash the remainder of 2021 flying, put a ton on american Eagle, then our baseline from which they have to grow is even smaller than it was in 2020. Grant tons of long term EILs, and then at that point our revenue is less than 35% and we furlough in November. Oh, and it isn’t until 2025 that it even matters (2027 actually). Then what? We grieve it? So...6-7 years from now we start the legal process while Eagle does 50% of our northeast flying and we have 1500 on furlough that whole time? Is JetBlue likely to do that? Probably not. But they can with this LOA. Until LOA13 is in place, there is no revenue sharing, and JetBlue can only allow Eagle to fly B6 code, but gets no monetary benefit. They are therefore more incentivized to outsource because of the revenue share. They still get a portion of the money but incur none of the cost. Unless I’m missing something from the secret revenue sharing model.
No reps have been able to address that point for me. They just say “trust me, that won’t happen. We don’t think they will do that.” One even said “it doesn’t matter where we fly, if Eagle takes all the short stuff, we will get new longer flights because we have ASM and block hour growth requirements, and flying is flying no matter where it is.” Well...no. 1) for the reasons above, the growth metrics and their lookback/enforcement time period are atrocious, and 2) giving away some flying thinking it was in exchange for other flying is exactly how the regionals proliferated in this country.
This is opening ourselves up for massive outsourcing to Eagle, as well as putting ourselves in the middle of a whipsaw with Eagle. Don’t do it.
01-31-2021, 08:53 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Posts: 172
Gotta say I agree. Again, it's a very small point and if my job depends on me overnighting in DTW every night then obviously I'd do it, but all that aside if I had a choice, I'd prefer to not start doing legacy airline style city pairs. On top of the many other reasons I say no to this, the idea that the union is just saying "Flying is flying" isn't exactly what JB is about.
I still can't believe the MEC agreed to a potential 12 year deal (Up to 10yr option with 2yr spooldown). That's effin bananas.
I still can't believe the MEC agreed to a potential 12 year deal (Up to 10yr option with 2yr spooldown). That's effin bananas.
01-31-2021, 09:04 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Position: CA
Posts: 1,226
01-31-2021, 09:25 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 2,010
I’m pretty sure you’re right. I’m just curious how much financial incentive there is for Jetblue to JV to the contractual limits of the LOA versus just doing most of the flying themselves. I’m sure I’ll never get an official answer. Hypothetically I would probably take this LOA a little more seriously if it was a shorter timeframe.
01-31-2021, 10:07 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2020
Posts: 537
LOA13 is a revenue sharing JV. We don’t know how much revenue is being shared with whom. LOA12 only allows a negligible amount of revenue share, if you can even call it that. Also, even if JetBlue flying its own metal is incentivized under the proposed JV, who is to say the revenue sharing arrangement can’t change down the road to make it more advantageous to give it to Eagle...at that point, nothing in the LOA prevents the JV arrangement, or structure of the revenue share, to change. None of those questions I can get answers to. I just see us has being hugely unprotected here in the worst case scenario, ie that this is exploited to the full extent possible by the NEA against us. Will it happen? No idea. Could it happen? No one in the union leadership has shown me how I am wrong yet. Just to “trust them” and “they don’t think they’d do that.”
01-31-2021, 10:08 AM
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: blueJet
Posts: 4,534
Fast forward several weeks. Delta files bankruptcy, and as a wholly-owned, Comair goes BK as well. Delta immediately notifies Comair that, due to Comair’s BK status, they will not be able to receive any more aircraft. The aircraft slated for Comair are instead going to Republic. Several aircraft currently at Comair are also redistributed amongst other Delta regionals.
Guess what happened to our pay? Still frozen, because a deal’s a deal.
The deal was, if Delta didn’t award Comair the promised aircraft, then TWO YEARS LATER our pay freeze is unfrozen. But in the meantime Delta 1113’d the Comair ALPA and the contract was negated. We never got the planes or the pay.
No hard feelings, though. I’m sure Delta had no idea that they were weeks from BK when, in good faith, they signed the deal with Comair.
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