Originally Posted by FyrePilot

I have to say while HA training was inefficient when compared to my time at OO and what others were experiencing at WN, the quality of training was good and the instructors, LCAs, and contract guys were all good quality and there were no personality conflicts. I was always well treated and supported.

If Alaska eventually gets 787s I am sure they will go senior and be based in SEA. That’s fine. I absolutely cannot stand the PNW. I have no desire to live, work, or be based there. I also have no desire to fly a 737 (even if it’s a max) for a company based in the PNW when I live in a WN base where it’s sunny, warm, and not drowning in homelessness and drugs. I went to HA to fly WB international- to do flying it would take 15+ years at a legacy to get. I planned on upgrading on the 330 for freight and then eventually making it back to the left seat in the pax side with a line in the left seat in about 10-12 years

Those plans and expectations are gone now.

I suppose it’s better than a bankruptcy as this acquisition provides a soft landing. It’s not the career stagnating black swan event but it is definitely not good for me or anyone else junior at HAL that had similar aspirations.

Originally Posted by GoodJet

AS was the only place that called back in 2017. I'm guessing things would be much different now but I don't want to give up on the seniority. Plus I'm not chasing big airplanes. Wishing you guys at HAL the best. If anything I hope it works out well for both pilot groups. I'm certainly not getting worked up over potential outcomes at this point.

Originally Posted by fuzzball

Thanks for painting the picture. With microscopic exceptions, the HAL senior training couldn't be more different from what you just described. I just spoke with a guy who recently transitioned from 321NEO to 330, with check pilots in the top 5%, he said it was the most chill, big picture, supportive training event of his career.

Originally Posted by GoodJet

Don't take it from me. Ask around about the 2023 CQ scenario at AS.

Hearing what you describe at HAL I'd love for that kind of positive learning to somehow make it's way to AS.

Originally Posted by rickair7777

In fairness, the AS 737 program evolved to revolve around the Alaska (state) flying which has a variety of unusual challenges and frankly does require a higher standard of pilot skill, and even aggrssiveness/assertiveness.

I don't have any need to do that kind of flying at this point in my life and career, and no desire to bid into those bases, but I do recognize it for what it is.

Culturally, yes it's different than some others I've done. Show up prepared and be assertive.

Originally Posted by GreatBigSea

Id love to see that Failure/Repeat rate for CQ 2023 compared to years past.

Originally Posted by FyrePilot

I think the fences in terms of WB airframes are a moot point for anyone not in top 20% of HA seniority in the next 5 years.

The 330s are old, most if not all, are leased. They will be gone sooner than later.

There are 12 787s coming to Hawaiian. That’s if nothing changes. Sure put up a fence for half of the current wide body fleet.

Phase out the other half of the current wide body fleet in exchange for 737 max 10s that are coming.

Fence HNL base- fine- pilots will fly 737 to mainland and then 2 more days of current Alaska 737 destinations then fly back to HNL. The senior Alaska guys will fly SEA to HNL and then do 2 days of interisland enjoying the overnights and then fly back to SEA.

Then in 5 years maybe Alaska starts taking 787s and the top of their seniority list will get those all based on SEA while everyone from HAL with the awesome SLI is stuck flying 737s domestically for rest of career. After 5 years no one is going to enforce career expectations, especially when wide body aircraft are not part of Alaska right now, it’s not like they are going to save them for HAL pilots when they make an order years from now.

Sorry to be so negative but it’s just how it is. Anyone junior at Hawaiian is not going to have career expectations met anywhere close to current. I guess that’s better than going through a bankruptcy and having to start over completely though.

We haven’t even mentioned starting JCBA negotiations in a weak global economy after everyone is ****ed from however the arbitration integrated the list.

Originally Posted by Fakawat

Lets not forget, we have the same group who negotiated the only concessionary contract in the past year in charge of our future.

Originally Posted by GoodJet

Don't take it from me. Ask around about the 2023 CQ scenario at AS.

Hearing what you describe at HAL I'd love for that kind of positive learning to somehow make it's way to AS.