Climategate--The Final Chapter
10-13-2012, 05:49 PM
#372
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
How to react to global warming (if at all) is certainly a political discussion, but the fact that politics gets inserted while simply looking at the numbers still amazes me. Everyone is entitled their opinion over how to deal with climate change -- but close your eyes and stick your fingers in your ears and your voice becomes irrelevant, and the result you most wish to avoid becomes more likely to occur.
That's like saying "There's absolutely no way my house is on fire, it's just warmer because it's July." The climate goes through cycles and global temperatures rise and fall, but what has happened in recent decades is so far out of normal cyclical patterns that there has to be something else going on.
That's like saying "There's absolutely no way my house is on fire, it's just warmer because it's July." The climate goes through cycles and global temperatures rise and fall, but what has happened in recent decades is so far out of normal cyclical patterns that there has to be something else going on.
10-13-2012, 05:54 PM
#374
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,025
There's a difference between quantity and rate. Current temperature levels are nothing compared to historic extremes, but the rate at which those levels are changing is unprecedented. If 100 people contracted the Bubonic Plague tomorrow would you be concerned? Would you oppose all public health action until the number of people infected in the 21st century met or exceeded the number of those infected in the 10th century?
10-13-2012, 06:02 PM
#375
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
There's a difference between quantity and rate. Current temperature levels are nothing compared to historic extremes, but the rate at which those levels are changing is unprecedented. If 100 people contracted the Bubonic Plague tomorrow would you be concerned? Would you oppose all public health action until the number of people infected in the 21st century met or exceeded the number of those infected in the 10th century?
10-13-2012, 06:17 PM
#376
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,025
Temperature levels go up and down and the Earth has definitely been a lot hotter than it is now. What is significant about current temperature readings is the rate at which those readings are increasing (in aggregate). I posted a chart on page 33 of this thread that shows a dramatic increase in the rate of change during the past 100 years.
I've read most (but I don't think all) of the posts in this thread and I posted a few times a few months ago. Jungle claimed that there wasn't a single report backed up by scientific data that showed that the Earth was getting warmer. I posted one from NASA, he didn't like it; I posted one from NOAA, he didn't like it. I realized that posting in this thread was like arguing with a bumper sticker and that the global warming debate is not a scientific debate, but a political one. I disagree with relying on opinion blogs and videos, be they of the alarmist or the denial stripe. I think it is important to clearly provide whatever data you are relying on to arrive at whatever conclusion you come to. You're absolutely right that Antarctic ice is expanding, and I think there has been an inverse correlation between the Arctic and the Antarctic ice levels for centuries. However, for the past few decades, the Arctic has lost over 5km of ice for every 1km that the Antarctic has gained. I think it is important to consider all evidence, whether confirming or disproving global warming. In all honesty, I'm open to the idea that man may not be causing global warming, but everything I've seen shows that the Earth is getting warmer and that warming is directly correlated (I know correlation is not causation) to CO2 levels.
Welcome to the discussion. Had you read more than 1 or 2 posts you might learn that some people here like to post all the bad news they can find while they ignore news they are unable to explain. Things like arctic ice is melting while they ignore antartic ice is expanding. Or glaciers are shrinking but not quite at the same rate they were shrinking in the 1940's or the fact that they are expanding elsewhere. We used to call those inconvenient truths untill some bozo ruined the expression.
10-13-2012, 09:13 PM
#378
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
And those darn brits find something else.
Global warming stopped 16 years ago, reveals Met Office report quietly released... and here is the chart to prove it | Mail Online
Global warming stopped 16 years ago, reveals Met Office report quietly released... and here is the chart to prove it | Mail Online
10-14-2012, 04:56 AM
#379
With The Resistance
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Burning the Agitprop of the Apparat
Posts: 6,191
All you really need to prove the hoax
All you really need to know about the hoax, nobody is buying it and they can't even give it away. This doesn't mean they won't try again later, but it does mean it has all the credibility of a Nigerian E-mail.
Do you know who owns ICE/Climate Exchange PLC? You should.
Reuters
7:32 a.m. CDT, August 8, 2011
Intercontinental Exchange Inc. will close its U.S. emissions derivatives platform, the Chicago Climate Futures Exchange, after the first quarter, the Wall Street Journal reported.
ICE plans to start listing derivatives related to emissions reductions plans in New Jersey, Massachussetts, Connecticut and California, along with a sulfur-based contract, the Journal said, citing a notice issued by the company to traders on Friday.
The company is shutting the exchange down as it is losing money and the chances of a federal carbon-reduction plan being put into place look slim, the Journal said.
ICE bought the platform's parent company Climate Exchange PLC in 2010 for about $600 million last year.
Do you know who owns ICE/Climate Exchange PLC? You should.
Reuters
7:32 a.m. CDT, August 8, 2011
Intercontinental Exchange Inc. will close its U.S. emissions derivatives platform, the Chicago Climate Futures Exchange, after the first quarter, the Wall Street Journal reported.
ICE plans to start listing derivatives related to emissions reductions plans in New Jersey, Massachussetts, Connecticut and California, along with a sulfur-based contract, the Journal said, citing a notice issued by the company to traders on Friday.
The company is shutting the exchange down as it is losing money and the chances of a federal carbon-reduction plan being put into place look slim, the Journal said.
ICE bought the platform's parent company Climate Exchange PLC in 2010 for about $600 million last year.
10-14-2012, 05:14 AM
#380
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2006
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 8,047
The most recent NOAA report I can find (August 2012) shows that this August, temperatures over the ocean and land were the fourth highest on record and tempatures over land were the second highest on record:
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