SkyHigh

HAL

Research in the Humans and Automation Lab (HAL) focuses on the multifaceted interactions of human and computer decision-making in complex sociotechnical systems. With the explosion of automated technology, the need for humans as supervisors of complex automatic control systems has replaced the need for humans in direct manual control.

HAL is where DR. Cummings works.

Online in Executive Travel: Missy Cummings, ... “We don’t need Chuck Yeager anymore.”

"The U.S. Air Force believes the best people to fly UAVs are officers with experience in an actual cockpit. But operating an unmanned aircraft requires different skills than flying a jet, argues MIT professor M.L. Cummings. The Air Force should take a page from the Army’s UAV manual and put enlisted nonpilots in control."

I believe that the airlines will hire people off the street without any previous piloting experience and put them through a similar training program as the Army and use them as on board technicians.

Skyhigh

SkyHigh

USMCFLYR,

Yes it does take a pilot to push the "ARM" button permitting the plane to deviate from the heading to join the localizer and follow the ILS to a landing.

In regards to my father he was one of the nations first to graduate with an engineering degree in aerospace in the nation. He worked on the early days of the space program. His dream though was to be a pilot for the Airforce. In college he was in the AFROTC and was granted a pilot slot upon graduation.

His employer however had his orders cancelled and draft status permanently suspended because of his value to the space industry. As a result he reluctantly left his initial dream behind and dove into his space career. He had a hand in most of the biggest achievements in the space race ending his career working on missile defense systems for the military.

At one time he was on a list with 200 other engineers as a possible candidate to be a technical advisor during the launch of Boeing's Initial Upper Stage rocket on board the space shuttle. Much of his career is hidden from us since he worked in classified programs. He is a pilot and very intelligent.

Skyhigh

SkyHigh

USMCFLYR,

I am sorry to have missed your question on another thread regarding my father and his interest in VOR's. I was very distracted at the time with the impending arrival of our son Roger.

Since my last post I have discovered your question and would like to provide an answer. As you know my father is an Aerospace and Electrical Engineer. As such his hobby has always been taking apart interesting electrical devices to better understand their operation. On one occasion I removed a malfunctioning VOR Navigational radio from my plane and gave it to him as a fun project to disassemble.

Not only did he take it apart but completely understood each electrical component and its function to the system. He found what the problem was and fixed it in short order. As he was reassembling it he described to me the details of VOR navigation and how the electronics worked in conjunction.

When he was finished he hooked it up to power to test it out. Remarkably however he could not use a chart to tune it in to the right station nor could he figure out how to track it to the station. I had to function test it for him. It is the mind of an engineer I guess.

Skyhigh

USMCFLYR

I was talking about the ILS working on the ground Sky
With all of the automated monitoring that exists, it is still a PERSON on the ground making it work (with the accompanying airborne validation - YEAH!)

Ah....from your intital post, you made it sound like you were talking about the VOR station, not an airplane receiver.

I hope you at least chose USMCFLYR as your son's middle name

USMCFLYR

Grumble

Talk to any captain that's flown with a 300 hour new hire. They'll tell you a different story. There is no automation for the thousands of decisions that have to be made on any given flight. You're woefully undereducated on where we're at right now with regards to automation, and thus living in a pipe dream trying to get rid of all of us.

SkyHigh

I have had this conversation many times before and I am sure that it is easier for the captain to have a FO with 5000 hours of high performance fighter jet time however that does not negate the fact that a 300 hour FO can get by. They cross the nation every hour of everyday without incident.

Thirty years ago airline pilots had to enter a hold over an ADF without moving map or a flight computer just a wrist watch and skill. It use to take experience to fly a transport category aircraft.

I am sure that from your perspective new pilots are well exposed to aviation. 1500 hours is an old salt though what I am saying is that it is impossible in the glass flight deck age to get anywhere close to what a 727 pilot had to be able to do.

Modern pilots are computer jockeys who monitor automated flight decks without any real piloting skill and they do not even know it. The advent of the glass flight deck has made it so that any computer age kid with Microsoft Flight Simulator at home can quickly learn how to monitor a modern transport category plane.

The only thing that matters is that the airlines can and do place inexperienced pilots in transport category planes because they can and they can because it does not take a thick resume of experience to fly for an airline anymore.

Why am I telling you this? Because there is no value in the profession anymore. Why should any airline pay for experienced pilots? The government can force them to hire new FO's at 1500 hours but they will find a way around it.

I am not trying to get rid of anyone. If you or anyone else wishes to invest their lives into this situation then be my guest. Someone needs to do it after all. However some of us are interested in making a living, being worth something to an employer and being justly compensated for our efforts.

The advancement of automation is slowly taking away a pilots value to the industry. If you don't believe me then just look at all that has happened over the last 10 years.

Skyhigh

DeadHead

Not sure what is more pathetic;
The amount of time you spend trying to belittle, demean, or trivialize the profession.
or,
The fact that you may actually believe what your saying.

Singapore A380 Safe After Rolls Engine Shutdown - Bloomberg

There you go, a modern aircraft, fresh off the line with all the bells and whistles. How do you explain this occurrence then? (And before you minimize what these guys did, do a little research)

DYNASTY HVY

"A whole new generation of pilots have never had the chance to train on the real scenarios that will affect them in the real world."

Computers originally were produced as a means to assist with certain tasks and not take over that task completely if my memory serves me correctly.
Automation in some aspects has a way of creating complacency.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles...-handling.html

BTW . Congrats on the boy .Sky


Ally

CrimsonEclipse

It all comes down to money.

When a single pilot airplane becomes more profitable, IT WILL HAPPEN.

As pilot pay shrinks, making a competing automation that is inexpensive becomes more difficult.

The other factor is reliability. Automation can fly an airplane straight, but can it compensate for failures. The term "self healing" is used in the industry.

When a cargo company shows its unmanned aircraft have an order of magnitude fewer accidents for 10 years, IT WILL HAPPEN. (just not yet)

SkyHigh

Thanks Ally, He is doing great.

Skyhigh