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AOPA's take on how to land an airliner

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Old 06-25-2011, 09:33 AM
  #11  
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Originally Posted by tortue
I'm glad AOPA is wasting its members money on such fine garbage.

They already release a publication which is essentially an advertisement for aircraft that 99% of their readers cannot afford (read the last few magazines, most of the aircraft are in the 1+ million range that they cover). The articles from Rod Machado and folks are rehashes from other locations (blogs, etc).

All this at the same time when they're wondering why GA is so low and all this garbage about "rallying GA". Perhaps they could spend a bit more time & money on actually subsidizing private pilot training? Or getting its 50+ year old members to give up not just discovery flights but perhaps provide an aircraft for training?
So wait you want AOPA to pay for other members flight training, and the "wealthier" member to provide the aircraft? Gee, where have I heard this train of thought.

The second they do that, my membership is cancelled.
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Old 06-25-2011, 10:52 AM
  #12  
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Originally Posted by Grumble
So wait you want AOPA to pay for other members flight training, and the "wealthier" member to provide the aircraft? Gee, where have I heard this train of thought.

The second they do that, my membership is cancelled.

That way, the "prospective" pilot can work for sub $20k/year. It's all part of the plan.

Subsidize to keep pilot pay low.
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Old 06-25-2011, 11:20 AM
  #13  
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Originally Posted by Grumble
So wait you want AOPA to pay for other members flight training, and the "wealthier" member to provide the aircraft? Gee, where have I heard this train of thought.
Hum? Where have we heard about redistribution of wealth before?
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Old 06-25-2011, 06:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Grumble
So wait you want AOPA to pay for other members flight training, and the "wealthier" member to provide the aircraft? Gee, where have I heard this train of thought.

The second they do that, my membership is cancelled.
Then don't do it and the AOPA old farts can stand around going "why are the number or private pilots decreasing so badly?!" year after year.

The only folks actually doing right is EAA, and AOPA frequently takes credit for their work both in Washington and across the country.

I'm sorry but I've been around too many old timer AOPA folks with nice aircraft that sit idle all whining about the lack of pilots. I'm not saying this should facilitate peoples flight training so they can jumpstart the shiny-jet-syndrome and the 20k/year salary. The shiny-jet-syndrome exists as long as the schools can continue to plaster advertisements all over the Internet. The problem with just giving up a single discovery flight is that its nice, but nothing happens further. A little bit here and there might knock off a few hundred dollars in the grand scheme of someones flight training. But I don't see anyone doing that. Hell, even letting someone fly along and give them tips and mentor them would be a good thing. But that's not going to happen when you're dealing with sycophants that are antisocial and don't want to extend a helping hand.

But props to the folks who turned this into an Obama/wealth redistribution thread. That really cements my impression of the AOPA crowd.

Last edited by tortue; 06-25-2011 at 06:36 PM. Reason: added a clarification
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Old 06-25-2011, 07:59 PM
  #15  
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Originally Posted by tortue
Then don't do it and the AOPA old farts can stand around going "why are the number or private pilots decreasing so badly?!" year after year.

The only folks actually doing right is EAA, and AOPA frequently takes credit for their work both in Washington and across the country.

I'm sorry but I've been around too many old timer AOPA folks with nice aircraft that sit idle all whining about the lack of pilots. I'm not saying this should facilitate peoples flight training so they can jumpstart the shiny-jet-syndrome and the 20k/year salary. The shiny-jet-syndrome exists as long as the schools can continue to plaster advertisements all over the Internet. The problem with just giving up a single discovery flight is that its nice, but nothing happens further. A little bit here and there might knock off a few hundred dollars in the grand scheme of someones flight training. But I don't see anyone doing that. Hell, even letting someone fly along and give them tips and mentor them would be a good thing. But that's not going to happen when you're dealing with sycophants that are antisocial and don't want to extend a helping hand.

But props to the folks who turned this into an Obama/wealth redistribution thread. That really cements my impression of the AOPA crowd.
1) Most pilots insurance will sky rocket if they try and rent out or provide their aircraft for instruction. I know mine will.

2) Most guys don't own vanilla training aircraft like 172's and Warriors that make good training platforms. A Lancair, Bonanza, RV, etc is not intended for that abuse, or is cost effective. Also, defer to point number 1.

3) Having given several hundred Young Eagle rides, I know for a fact that several went on to pursue their own flight training through hard work, like most people. They went out and got jobs to pay for their flight training as teenagers. Imagine that concept! Several others went on to join the military and get their flight training paid for that way.

Where the hell did the principle of hard work go in this country? If you want something, go out and earn it. Subsidizing your kids flight training is not the role of the government, public organizations, etc. I cleaned sh1t out of dog kennels for 2 years to pay for my private pilots license in high school. Nothing in life is free, or at least it didn't used to be.
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Old 06-25-2011, 10:52 PM
  #16  
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Originally Posted by Grumble
Where the hell did the principle of hard work go in this country? If you want something, go out and earn it. Subsidizing your kids flight training is not the role of the government, public organizations, etc. I cleaned sh1t out of dog kennels for 2 years to pay for my private pilots license in high school. Nothing in life is free, or at least it didn't used to be.
Amen brother.
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Old 06-29-2011, 05:29 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Grumble
Where the hell did the principle of hard work go in this country? If you want something, go out and earn it. Subsidizing your kids flight training is not the role of the government, public organizations, etc. I cleaned sh1t out of dog kennels for 2 years to pay for my private pilots license in high school. Nothing in life is free, or at least it didn't used to be.
Every single generation since antiquity has said this -- that the young people have no work ethic like they did...

Call me crazy, but I think the reason my nieces / nephews and other young people I encounter aren't as much interested in flight is because of... computers. On any free weekend I was flying my R/C planes (couldn't get into the real thing until I was a bit older). Nowadays the kids sit in front of the computer... video games are often "better" than the real thing... they want to be a rich a** like Mark Zuckerberg instead of Charles Lindbergh. Flight is a mature industry when viewed in comparison.

Also, I'm a cardiologist, and sometimes I find the cost of private piloting daunting. It would be pretty impossible for high schooler IMO.
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Old 06-29-2011, 05:51 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by cardiomd
Also, I'm a cardiologist, and sometimes I find the cost of private piloting daunting. It would be pretty impossible for high schooler IMO.
Exactly...

a NICE computer setup with MS Flight Sim, full control setup, etc is less than $2k... Then you're just paying the electric bill and maybe the internet, but Mom & Dad are probably covering that anyway. You can fly anywhere in the world with that.

A PPL: $6k on the very low side, more realistically $8k-$10k. Then you have a license that you can't use without spending more than $100/hr to get somewhere, then, $100/night at a hotel, then ~$50 in food, and then all applicable ramp fees, etc.

Say you work part time and/or summers... making maybe $10k/year, of which half of that will go towards filling your car with gas and paying the insurance. That's 2 years of your life just to get a PPL while sacrificing going out with friends on the weekends and having fun when you're supposed to.

[tangent]The generations before might think that they have a better work ethic, but they certainly have done a terrible job at maintaining a good savings ethic, sound currency ethic, or any sense of honour. Passing along trillions in debt to the next generation just so that Grampa Joe and Grandma Betty who didn't save a dime for retirement can go play bingo every Wednesday night is just wrong.[/tangent]
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