How to fly a DC9-30
09-08-2009, 12:49 AM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: B-737NG preferably in first class with a glass of champagne and caviar
Posts: 5,995
Blame it on the upcoming Autumnal Equinox Syndrom.
09-08-2009, 05:07 AM
#22
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2008
Position: B717 FO
Posts: 210
The autopilot is very crude. Whoever wrote that it can be flown smoothly with extra effort is spot-on. When I started flying it, I had a couple of NW guys beat it into me how to fly it smoothly. In the beginning, it was a monkey w/ football for most new guys. The auto-throttles really suck too. If you want to be smooth, leave them off.
Also, it could be that the autopilot was messing up. I know I've written up a few gripes on the exact problem with the heading drifting and then an abrupt correction.
C9
Also, it could be that the autopilot was messing up. I know I've written up a few gripes on the exact problem with the heading drifting and then an abrupt correction.
C9
09-08-2009, 06:18 AM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2005
Posts: 233
I'm sure you're pax appreciate that.
09-08-2009, 06:26 AM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2007
Position: Capt
Posts: 3,215
Hi!
The autopilots in the -9 are, overall, crap. They are ALWAYS inconsistent. Sometimes they are MELd. We were having a problem with ours porpoising once the GS was captured. That seemed to go away, but then we'll be coupled, and everything great on the ILS, all configured, and THEN it starts porpoising. Have to turn it off and hand-fly, or hook it back up again and see...sometimes it is fine, other times, not. The MD autopilots are light-years better than the -9 ones...digital vs. mechanical.
The heading knob in the one I'm flying now is also inconsistent. Sometimes it banks the plane abruptly, and sometimes it does nothing for a while, and then starts to move the heading bug.
The other thing I don't like is the VS wheel. I swear to God, every time you move it out of the detent, EITHER way, you get a rather abrupt pitch change in the OPPOSITE direction, and then it starts to do what you want it to do!s
Sometimes it makes me wish I was back in the Falcon 20. The better F20s were WAY better than the -9, but the crappier F20s were crappier than the -9s.
The one I'm flying now is relatively nice. I like that it is a -30 with -17 engines, it has a TRI/EPR computer (like the -50s at NWA/DAL), and it has the Flt Dir/Heading bug where the modern autopilots are, in the middle of the dash, under the glareshield. The Garmin GPS is VERY nice!
It has some other odd quirks that aren't so nice, but I have found that true with all the -9s I've flown. I am hoping to get some MD time sooner, rather than later.
cliff
NBO
The autopilots in the -9 are, overall, crap. They are ALWAYS inconsistent. Sometimes they are MELd. We were having a problem with ours porpoising once the GS was captured. That seemed to go away, but then we'll be coupled, and everything great on the ILS, all configured, and THEN it starts porpoising. Have to turn it off and hand-fly, or hook it back up again and see...sometimes it is fine, other times, not. The MD autopilots are light-years better than the -9 ones...digital vs. mechanical.
The heading knob in the one I'm flying now is also inconsistent. Sometimes it banks the plane abruptly, and sometimes it does nothing for a while, and then starts to move the heading bug.
The other thing I don't like is the VS wheel. I swear to God, every time you move it out of the detent, EITHER way, you get a rather abrupt pitch change in the OPPOSITE direction, and then it starts to do what you want it to do!s
Sometimes it makes me wish I was back in the Falcon 20. The better F20s were WAY better than the -9, but the crappier F20s were crappier than the -9s.
The one I'm flying now is relatively nice. I like that it is a -30 with -17 engines, it has a TRI/EPR computer (like the -50s at NWA/DAL), and it has the Flt Dir/Heading bug where the modern autopilots are, in the middle of the dash, under the glareshield. The Garmin GPS is VERY nice!
It has some other odd quirks that aren't so nice, but I have found that true with all the -9s I've flown. I am hoping to get some MD time sooner, rather than later.
cliff
NBO
09-08-2009, 08:57 AM
#25
No one's home
Joined APC: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,091
Didn't fly the -9 but did fly the -80. The point is that with autopilot and autothrottles, there are some rough birds out there. But if you have pax on board, a good stick will find a way to smooth things out. Sounds like you either had someone who didn't care or was a hotdog. Maybe both.
09-08-2009, 10:54 AM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2009
Position: B-757/767 Capt.
Posts: 219
Early in my career I flew 20 series Lears for a charter company that had a Chief Pilot who was an absolute fanatic about smooth flying. He never wanted to feel climbs or descents, insisted on slow power changes and God help you if he felt the airplane rock when coming to a stop while taxiing. He always said that with the exception of unavoidable turbulence the only way a passenger should know there is movement is the shade moving across his newspaper.
Bottom line: You either flew smooth or you got fired, period!
His way became the culture at our company and we found it fun to challenge ourselves and each other flying as smooth as possible. Still not uncommon in corporate flight departments. People don't buy Gulfstreams and Falcons so they can be slung around the cabin by some hamfisted clown who ended up with an ATP.
Fast forward 31 years and that hard to please Chief Pilot still crosses my mind on every trip I fly. I'm thankful for him being a part of my developement.
I don't claim to be anywhere near the smoothest stick around but it will never be because I don't try.
It sickens me when pilots just don't care, race around while taxiing giving 200 passengers an egg shaped butt hole at every turn, raising neckties at every descent and power changes I wouldn't consider with a lawn mower.
If I'm too tired to fly smooth then I'm too tired to fly! I will try my best for the 13 years I have remaining, not for my company, not even for my passengers, just for myself. This is my chosen profession and I still respect it.
09-08-2009, 06:33 PM
#28
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2009
Posts: 798
So yesterday I non-revved on a Northwest DC9-30. Throughout the entire flight (2 hours), the aircraft would rather abruptly make 10 degree heading changes every 60 seconds or so.
Additionally, it was apparent the aircraft had two thrust settings: full & idle. Every time the aircraft would descend, the throttles would go full idle, the nose would drop 10 degrees, and we all (the passengers) would go weightless (like on a roller coaster) for a second or two.
Now I don't know whether these behaviors are normal, but I must say that, even for a seasoned passenger, it was quite uncomfortable. All you Mad Dog Drivers out there, please enlighten me.
Additionally, it was apparent the aircraft had two thrust settings: full & idle. Every time the aircraft would descend, the throttles would go full idle, the nose would drop 10 degrees, and we all (the passengers) would go weightless (like on a roller coaster) for a second or two. Now I don't know whether these behaviors are normal, but I must say that, even for a seasoned passenger, it was quite uncomfortable. All you Mad Dog Drivers out there, please enlighten me.I flew the DC9s and this is not normal. The DC9 can be flown as smooth as any aircraft with a well trained pilot.
09-09-2009, 11:29 AM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2007
Position: Delta
Posts: 343
The other thing I don't like is the VS wheel. I swear to God, every time you move it out of the detent, EITHER way, you get a rather abrupt pitch change in the OPPOSITE direction, and then it starts to do what you want it to do!s
Sometimes it makes me wish I was back in the Falcon 20. The better F20s were WAY better than the -9, but the crappier F20s were crappier than the -9s.
Cheers
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