High Flight
06-09-2009, 12:15 PM
#1
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High Flight
In the modern world of airplanes that computers fly, I thought it would be nice to remember what it was like to fly airplanes instead of autopilots. As I am closing in on retiring from the airlines, I am drawn to recall the joy of flying that I use to have 30 years ago flying a Decathlon and then as a young lieutenant flying in the military. The study of WW1 aviation and my current build project of a Fokker Dr.1 Triplane has re-kindled that early love of flying, which has led me to start this forum.
My intent is to provide a forum to discuss:
The Feel of Flying – remember when we could “hear” the airplane talk to us? Remember when we feel the “seat of the pants” type of flying? Remember when we looked at a map and plotted a course using ground reference check points? Remember when we use to chase clouds?
Love of Flight
Eagledriver
My intent is to provide a forum to discuss:
The Feel of Flying – remember when we could “hear” the airplane talk to us? Remember when we feel the “seat of the pants” type of flying? Remember when we looked at a map and plotted a course using ground reference check points? Remember when we use to chase clouds?
Love of Flight
Eagledriver
06-09-2009, 01:23 PM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,839
I'm happy to report Eagledriver that I felt like that today - at least as much as possible! No autopilot - no autothrottles - had a nice nav system but had briefed the mission using ground references for the route out ot and back from the working area, the boundaries of the working/tgt area, and all the way to tgt aquisition for a visual delivery. I was even able to *feel* a little bit of the airplane in the dive and the pull off target.
I can appreciate your thoughts on this topic and the manner in which you are trying to rekindle the *old* feel of flying is admirable. that must be quite a project airplane that you have going. Best of luck!
USMCFLYR
I can appreciate your thoughts on this topic and the manner in which you are trying to rekindle the *old* feel of flying is admirable. that must be quite a project airplane that you have going. Best of luck!
USMCFLYR
06-09-2009, 09:04 PM
#3
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Control the Complacency
USMCFLYR,
You are correct in that it is quite a project. Fuselage, tail, and horizontal stab almost complete. Working with a friend to make the axle box for the landing gear - yahoo!
I like your "rekindle the old feeling". On another forum we were discussing the first flight in a WW1 replica. Stuff like "chair flying" and visualizing going through the motions in the cockpit. That's when it hit me, ANTICIPATION. In our modern airliners the computer FMS is flying the autopilot as well as the airplane for hours on end, we have stopped anticipating that something will go wrong. Everything is so reliable (which is great for safety - bad for pilot complacency). Lets face it the WW1 pilots and the "between the wars" barnstormers knew something was going wrong and always planned on it.
So the question is how do we control the complacency? Maybe hand flying the jet from top of descent whenever we can - I don't know. I want to leave the systems operator mentality and return to the pilot mentality.
C'ya
Eagledriver
You are correct in that it is quite a project. Fuselage, tail, and horizontal stab almost complete. Working with a friend to make the axle box for the landing gear - yahoo!
I like your "rekindle the old feeling". On another forum we were discussing the first flight in a WW1 replica. Stuff like "chair flying" and visualizing going through the motions in the cockpit. That's when it hit me, ANTICIPATION. In our modern airliners the computer FMS is flying the autopilot as well as the airplane for hours on end, we have stopped anticipating that something will go wrong. Everything is so reliable (which is great for safety - bad for pilot complacency). Lets face it the WW1 pilots and the "between the wars" barnstormers knew something was going wrong and always planned on it.
So the question is how do we control the complacency? Maybe hand flying the jet from top of descent whenever we can - I don't know. I want to leave the systems operator mentality and return to the pilot mentality.
C'ya
Eagledriver
06-09-2009, 09:38 PM
#4
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
Posts: 13,839
The safer the better for the passengers no doubt. So if letting the autopilot fly enroute or the approach is actually safer than the pilot hand flying for whatever reason - then that is the way it needs to be IMO. Unfortunately - the gig doesn't pay enough nowadays it seems to even allow most pilots the opporutnity to fly on the side. Many probably don't want to fly on the side either, but that would be one way to maintain the stick and rudders skills and battle complacency. Shuttle pilots get currency hops - not that the airlines are going to pay for that perk either 
In any case - I'm glad to currently have the opportunity to experience both kinds of flying to a degree. I look forward to the day where I might just get to skip the brief, fly for the fun of it, and not worry about a detailed debrief too
Recreational flying!
I hope you eventualy post some pictures of your restoration project. Maybe you could even start a series of threads detailing the project.
Again...best of luck!
USMCFLYR
In any case - I'm glad to currently have the opportunity to experience both kinds of flying to a degree. I look forward to the day where I might just get to skip the brief, fly for the fun of it, and not worry about a detailed debrief too
Recreational flying!I hope you eventualy post some pictures of your restoration project. Maybe you could even start a series of threads detailing the project.
Again...best of luck!
USMCFLYR
06-15-2009, 07:18 AM
#5
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Suggestions made about Air France Breakup
Reading other threads about the AF tragedy, a common thread is "Fly the Jet". It seems that non-pilots are acknowledging the "systems operator" mentality of flying may not be the smartest thing to promote. Yahoo the veil has been lifted for the moment.
Back in the day of WW1 & Barnstorming, pilots anticipated that something will go wrong. Now being a computer programmer in the cockpit we build the final turn on the FMS. What happen to looking out the window?
What happen to flying?
Eagledriver
Back in the day of WW1 & Barnstorming, pilots anticipated that something will go wrong. Now being a computer programmer in the cockpit we build the final turn on the FMS. What happen to looking out the window?
What happen to flying?
Eagledriver
06-15-2009, 07:24 AM
#6
Flying Farmer
Joined APC: Jul 2006
Position: Turbo-props' and John Deere's
Posts: 3,160
Watched in jealousy, as about 2hrs ago there was a Ford Tri-Motor that stopped in here, for a quick fuel stop, and motored off into the horizon. It was the EAA's bird, got to walk up into the cockpit and check it out!
06-15-2009, 08:39 AM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: Student Pilot
Posts: 409
Eagle I would love to see some pictures of that project you have going on...
I am a huge fan of WW2 era birds, and even though you are a few years ahead, I would love to see it.
My favorites are (in no real order)
F4(u i think) Corsair
F6F Hellcat
P38 lightning
BF109
P61 Black widow
Super Marine Spitfire
Also really like the Mosquito(I think thats the name) The Brits wooden bomber....
I am a huge fan of WW2 era birds, and even though you are a few years ahead, I would love to see it.
My favorites are (in no real order)
F4(u i think) Corsair
F6F Hellcat
P38 lightning
BF109
P61 Black widow
Super Marine Spitfire
Also really like the Mosquito(I think thats the name) The Brits wooden bomber....
06-17-2009, 02:54 PM
#8
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My Triplane
This is the picture of what my Triplane will look like in 2011 when I fly it. 2011 is the 30th anniversary of pinning on my wings in the Air Force.
This is a picture of where I am on the fuselage. Intend to complete the metal work this year. The wings and spars next year. Hang a Continental 670 in 2011 to fly.
Good 2 Go
Eagledriver
check6
This is a picture of where I am on the fuselage. Intend to complete the metal work this year. The wings and spars next year. Hang a Continental 670 in 2011 to fly.
Good 2 Go
Eagledriver
check6
06-17-2009, 02:57 PM
#9
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Ewfflyer, you are correct - Tri-Motor is most excellent. That was the day.
JayDee, couldn't afford a P-38 (my favorite) so I thought of a Triplane. Same thing only different!
Eagledriver
check 6
JayDee, couldn't afford a P-38 (my favorite) so I thought of a Triplane. Same thing only different!
Eagledriver
check 6
06-21-2009, 08:15 PM
#10
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The Poem
High Flight
Oh! I have slipped the surly bonds of Earth
And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings;
Sunward I've climbed, and joined the tumbling mirth
Of sun-split clouds, — and done a hundred things
You have not dreamed of — wheeled and soared and swung
High in the sunlit silence. Hov'ring there,
I've chased the shouting wind along, and flung
My eager craft through footless halls of air. . . .
Oh! I have slipped the surly bonds of Earth
And danced the skies on laughter-silvered wings;
Sunward I've climbed, and joined the tumbling mirth
Of sun-split clouds, — and done a hundred things
You have not dreamed of — wheeled and soared and swung
High in the sunlit silence. Hov'ring there,
I've chased the shouting wind along, and flung
My eager craft through footless halls of air. . . .
Up, up the long, delirious burning blue
I've topped the wind-swept heights with easy grace
Where never lark, or ever eagle flew —
And, while with silent, lifting mind I've trod
The high untrespassed sanctity of space,
Put out my hand, and touched the face of God.
I've topped the wind-swept heights with easy grace
Where never lark, or ever eagle flew —
And, while with silent, lifting mind I've trod
The high untrespassed sanctity of space,
Put out my hand, and touched the face of God.
by Pilot Officer Gillespie Magee
No 412 squadron, RCAF
Killed 11 December 1941
No 412 squadron, RCAF
Killed 11 December 1941
I remember my first ever solo in a Cessna 150 back in 1976. Thought something was wrong because the aircraft tookoff like a rocket without my father in the other seat. I had never experienced such an explosive takeoff. Wow I felt I "topped the wind-swept heights with easy grace."
C'ya
Eagledriver
check 6
C'ya
Eagledriver
check 6
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