A Captain's advice
10-24-2008, 08:12 PM
#1
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A Captain's advice
I'm working in the Supervisor of Elections office on a temp assignment until I leave for flight training. Today, an AA B-767 Captain came by to p/u his absentee ballot. He was in uniform; no tie...no hat. I got chance to talk with him and this was his advice:
"Get your training done. You'll have roughly 250-350 hours. Get hired at AE; build up your TT and turbine time....quit; then go someplace else where you want to work, get the quick upgrade and enjoy the rest of your years in this profession as a regional captain".
I know that some of you have said that a person should flight instruct for the experience. Some have suggested at least a year. But from what this captain was telling me....he said that you don't need to flight instruct. "Build your time son at AE and get your career started."
Oh, btw, he did emphatically say to stay away from PFT. You won't hear about PFT from me any more!!!
atp
"Get your training done. You'll have roughly 250-350 hours. Get hired at AE; build up your TT and turbine time....quit; then go someplace else where you want to work, get the quick upgrade and enjoy the rest of your years in this profession as a regional captain".
I know that some of you have said that a person should flight instruct for the experience. Some have suggested at least a year. But from what this captain was telling me....he said that you don't need to flight instruct. "Build your time son at AE and get your career started."
Oh, btw, he did emphatically say to stay away from PFT. You won't hear about PFT from me any more!!!
atp
10-25-2008, 07:24 AM
#2
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If someone will hire you or anyone with 250 hours in the next year or so have at it. I think that being a CFI or other is a prerequisite now and will be for the next few years. Being a CFI makes you an all around better pilot but it will not progress your career necessarily, only time on seniority list will do that.
Theoretically he is correct the faster you get to an airline and start gaining seniority the faster you get to upgrade and the further away from furlough you get and the list goes on. It will be sad though if that upgrade comes in 2 years and you are 2000 hours shy of meeting the mins to upgrade. There are alot of furloughed regional guys that took this same path and their commercial multi ratings with 1000TT and 90 PIC and .35 cents will make a phone call.
Theoretically he is correct the faster you get to an airline and start gaining seniority the faster you get to upgrade and the further away from furlough you get and the list goes on. It will be sad though if that upgrade comes in 2 years and you are 2000 hours shy of meeting the mins to upgrade. There are alot of furloughed regional guys that took this same path and their commercial multi ratings with 1000TT and 90 PIC and .35 cents will make a phone call.
10-25-2008, 01:22 PM
#3
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Joined APC: Apr 2007
Position: 767 FO
Posts: 876
Career advice is rarely unbiased. Most individuals will tell you to follow the path that they or their close associates took. A lot of people will assume they know what is going on in an industry based on what they see as the current situation from their "foxhole." If you listen to only one individual or just do what the people around you are doing you may end up where they are, but that is a big may. Even if you do get to where you were advised to get to you may not be happy.
That AA captain is likely generations removed from your situation. The basics of getting hired are the same but he pitched you very narrow minded advice. There is much more to this industry than regional airlines and there is no reason why you should settle for being a regional captain if what you really want is big iron, exotic destiations, adventure off-the-beaten-path, or a sleepy airport flying tourists out to a fishing hole.
There are tons of ways to earn flight time towards that bigger and better job, but being a CFI is one of the, if not the job with the lowest flight hours entry requirement necessary to start building more and more time. If you are unwilling to move or unwilling to take one of those more "creative jobs" (flying checks, divers, the ditch etc) then you are seriously limiting your options.
That AA captain is likely generations removed from your situation. The basics of getting hired are the same but he pitched you very narrow minded advice. There is much more to this industry than regional airlines and there is no reason why you should settle for being a regional captain if what you really want is big iron, exotic destiations, adventure off-the-beaten-path, or a sleepy airport flying tourists out to a fishing hole.
There are tons of ways to earn flight time towards that bigger and better job, but being a CFI is one of the, if not the job with the lowest flight hours entry requirement necessary to start building more and more time. If you are unwilling to move or unwilling to take one of those more "creative jobs" (flying checks, divers, the ditch etc) then you are seriously limiting your options.
10-25-2008, 01:49 PM
#4
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Career advice is rarely unbiased. Most individuals will tell you to follow the path that they or their close associates took. A lot of people will assume they know what is going on in an industry based on what they see as the current situation from their "foxhole." If you listen to only one individual or just do what the people around you are doing you may end up where they are, but that is a big may. Even if you do get to where you were advised to get to you may not be happy.
That AA captain is likely generations removed from your situation. The basics of getting hired are the same but he pitched you very narrow minded advice. There is much more to this industry than regional airlines and there is no reason why you should settle for being a regional captain if what you really want is big iron, exotic destiations, adventure off-the-beaten-path, or a sleepy airport flying tourists out to a fishing hole.
There are tons of ways to earn flight time towards that bigger and better job, but being a CFI is one of the, if not the job with the lowest flight hours entry requirement necessary to start building more and more time. If you are unwilling to move or unwilling to take one of those more "creative jobs" (flying checks, divers, the ditch etc) then you are seriously limiting your options.
That AA captain is likely generations removed from your situation. The basics of getting hired are the same but he pitched you very narrow minded advice. There is much more to this industry than regional airlines and there is no reason why you should settle for being a regional captain if what you really want is big iron, exotic destiations, adventure off-the-beaten-path, or a sleepy airport flying tourists out to a fishing hole.
There are tons of ways to earn flight time towards that bigger and better job, but being a CFI is one of the, if not the job with the lowest flight hours entry requirement necessary to start building more and more time. If you are unwilling to move or unwilling to take one of those more "creative jobs" (flying checks, divers, the ditch etc) then you are seriously limiting your options.
He actually appeared to be in his late 40's to early 50's. I'm 46.
In my quest, I've listen and weighed the advice from those here at APC, pilots that I run into when I travel and those at jet a/c previews such as the one in Boca Raton, FL (BCT) earlier this year and the one at FXE this past Thursday. So I have a wide and varying range of input to draw some concrete solutions.
I have chartered a career path for the regionals, corporate, 135 and Cargo respectively. I under the strong impression that I will be flight instructing or something to that effect to get to the magical 1200 or 1500TT for insurance purposes. I have mixed and matched scenarios that would optimize the path that I chose. As far as 91 & 135, I believe a big part of it has to do with who you know. Sitting SIC in a KingAir with only 250-350 hours would be the shizzle, however those opportunities come far and in between.
It's ironic isn't it.....you can fly a jet @ 500mph with 50 souls on board with 250 hours, but you can't fly a turbo prop that seats 14 and cruises at 350kts.
Go figure.
atp
10-25-2008, 01:52 PM
#5
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The biggest problem with that route is NO PIC TIME!!!! You will not get upgraded without it! Besides, you need at least 250 PIC for the ATP. I know of some guys who had to go out and rent a Cessna 152 (with their FO salary) because they skipped instructing to go to one of those places that hired them with under 300 TT.
And please forgive my ignorance, but what is "PFT"? Is that Primary Flight Training? If so, it is true that some people find teaching primary students to be stressful, annoying, scary, frustrating, etc. It can be all of those things, but you really learn patience if you choose to.
You also have amazing moments. I feel an awesome surge of joy each time one of my primary students solos. I'll never forget the first student that I soloed. I was nervous, but I was so happy to see him fly like a champ. I hope these experiences will help me be a better captain in the future.
And please forgive my ignorance, but what is "PFT"? Is that Primary Flight Training? If so, it is true that some people find teaching primary students to be stressful, annoying, scary, frustrating, etc. It can be all of those things, but you really learn patience if you choose to.
You also have amazing moments. I feel an awesome surge of joy each time one of my primary students solos. I'll never forget the first student that I soloed. I was nervous, but I was so happy to see him fly like a champ. I hope these experiences will help me be a better captain in the future.
10-25-2008, 02:42 PM
#7
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Build TT at eagle, quit, THEN go somewhere, start as FO at the bottom of a new seniority list, then upgrade??? why not just bypass eagle, and get your seniority at the place you will eventually upgrade???
10-25-2008, 02:43 PM
#8
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Position: FAA 'Flight Check'
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[QUOTE]Not generations removed from your AGE, but generations removed from your position in the flying industry is what he was saying I think.
I got it that the jet job is a regional - what job is the turboprop?
I figured that one was as an FO with a seasoned Captain at your side and the other was as a single pilot PIC with no one at you side for back-up.
USMCFLYR
It's ironic isn't it.....you can fly a jet @ 500mph with 50 souls on board with 250 hours, but you can't fly a turbo prop that seats 14 and cruises at 350kts.
I figured that one was as an FO with a seasoned Captain at your side and the other was as a single pilot PIC with no one at you side for back-up.
USMCFLYR
10-25-2008, 02:50 PM
#9
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[QUOTE=USMCFLYR;485539]
Not generations removed from your AGE, but generations removed from your position in the flying industry is what he was saying I think.
I got it that the jet job is a regional - what job is the turboprop?
I figured that one was as an FO with a seasoned Captain at your side and the other was as a single pilot PIC with no one at you side for back-up.
USMCFLYR
The SIC is in a KingAir 200. I talk with a pilot and Dir of Ops from SkyLimo Air Charter at the NBAA Business Aircraft and Jet Preview this past Thursday. The event and SkyLimo...was held and is based at FXE respectively.
atp
Not generations removed from your AGE, but generations removed from your position in the flying industry is what he was saying I think.
I got it that the jet job is a regional - what job is the turboprop?
I figured that one was as an FO with a seasoned Captain at your side and the other was as a single pilot PIC with no one at you side for back-up.
USMCFLYR
The SIC is in a KingAir 200. I talk with a pilot and Dir of Ops from SkyLimo Air Charter at the NBAA Business Aircraft and Jet Preview this past Thursday. The event and SkyLimo...was held and is based at FXE respectively.
atp
Last edited by atpwannabe; 10-26-2008 at 02:49 AM.
10-25-2008, 02:53 PM
#10
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I agree, b/c my response to that was "that's a lot of lateral movememt". After flight instructing, my hope is that whichever company/airline I'm hired at, I can finish my career there.
atp
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