Teacher Salaries
12-18-2005, 05:08 PM
#21
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,242
Skyhigh - what airlines did you work for?
Dont worry I'm not going to check your background...I only know one person at the majors (UAL , he retired a few years ago - he and my father were in the Indian AF together in the 60s/70s/early 80s....)
-LA
Dont worry I'm not going to check your background...I only know one person at the majors (UAL , he retired a few years ago - he and my father were in the Indian AF together in the 60s/70s/early 80s....)
-LA
12-18-2005, 05:30 PM
#23
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,242
I'm stationed in Virginia - Langley now...I'll be back in LFT over the holidays...Maybe one day we can go up for a few hours - split the rental 50/50 log the time in accordance with FARs...:-)
My father flew the line for PHI for 24 years - before that he was AF for 14...
-LA
My father flew the line for PHI for 24 years - before that he was AF for 14...
-LA
12-18-2005, 09:22 PM
#24
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 184
Originally Posted by LAfrequentflyer
I'm stationed in Virginia - Langley now...I'll be back in LFT over the holidays...Maybe one day we can go up for a few hours - split the rental 50/50 log the time in accordance with FARs...:-)
My father flew the line for PHI for 24 years - before that he was AF for 14...
-LA
My father flew the line for PHI for 24 years - before that he was AF for 14...
-LA
12-18-2005, 09:35 PM
#25
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,242
PM me - i won't have time this trip because of family and stuff...But I'd like to when I'm home during the summer...I usually rent from Lafayette Aero (FBO at KLFT)...Of course, I don't mind the drive to Baton Rouge...I'd like to fly north and west to gulfport and florida (long x-country) stuff to build my hours...
I'm a support officer - work on computer systems supporting intelligence operations for air combat command...
You?
-LA
I'm a support officer - work on computer systems supporting intelligence operations for air combat command...
You?
-LA
12-18-2005, 09:56 PM
#26
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 184
I am in college right now. I recently joined the LA ANG, and will be an F-15 Crew Chief. I leave for basic, and tech. school on January 10th. I'll be back this summer with that, and if you are around during the summer we can meet up and build some XC time. I need to do the same.
I have flown into KLFT a few times and been into LFT Aero, so I am somewhat familiar with the place. Do you have plans to fly for the airlines, or Air Force, or do you simply fly for fun?
I have flown into KLFT a few times and been into LFT Aero, so I am somewhat familiar with the place. Do you have plans to fly for the airlines, or Air Force, or do you simply fly for fun?
12-19-2005, 04:54 AM
#27
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2005
Posts: 2,242
I fly for fun...
After retirement I will fly for a living. I'd like to work for Airnet or another night air cargo company. I could be happy flying a light-twin - single pilot is my big requirement...
I will be old and jaded by the time I retire from the AF - I don't want to share a 'small' space with another person for hours on end.
If you are young and have a degree - look into flying for the AF on active duty...Thanks for serving your country.
-LA
After retirement I will fly for a living. I'd like to work for Airnet or another night air cargo company. I could be happy flying a light-twin - single pilot is my big requirement...
I will be old and jaded by the time I retire from the AF - I don't want to share a 'small' space with another person for hours on end.
If you are young and have a degree - look into flying for the AF on active duty...Thanks for serving your country.
-LA
12-19-2005, 07:33 AM
#28
Self Employed.
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
ChrisH
ChrisH,
Thank you for your condolence, my career is a huge disappointment, but even if I had made it to my goal I would only be making 65K right now. After you subtract taxes and other expenses it isn't that great. The people whom I know who have made it to what was once considered a great job are now calling me for advise on how to start their own construction business.
I worked for National Airlines, Horizon Airlines and a prominent Northwest Charter company. Before that it was 7 years of Alaskan bush flying for various operators.
Had I stayed at Horizon I would be making 50 after 8 years with the company. If I had stayed with the big jet charter outfit I would be making around 45K as a Lear/Challenger captain by now. At the time National was considered the favorite over JB and payed it captains 55K.
None of those jobs were that good. In fact I envied the rampers when I was at Horizon because the company treated them better than the pilots. My career was no different than most other peoples. I know a guy who flies for SWA and lives in a camper in a huge gravel parking lot neat the Baltimore airport since he is on reserve. The good times are mostly gone in the airlines now. Sure there are a few single guys who are having a blast. They don't mind being gone all the time and hotels are great since you don't have to clean them. It is a different story for families who need a real income and need you to be home more.
If you are single and don't have a life otherwise you might be alright at 24K or even at 48K. As I mentioned before most of us became pilots to have a better life and to earn more than the average guy. It takes at least 100K for a family of four to live a middle class lifestyle in the big city right now and 150 to 200K to make it to upper middle class. 48K is an embarrassment, it is a poverty wage. You can't properly support a family on that.
You probably will not understand until you have a family of your own who is crammed into a 2 bedroom apartment in a slummy area and you are leaving them to go on another 5 day trip after being back for only 2 days. What fun! This profession was once truly great, lots of time off huge paychecks respect from management, now it is just an OK job and sinking into a horrible one. Even the majors are not that appealing anymore. My generation signed up for great.
SkyHigh
Thank you for your condolence, my career is a huge disappointment, but even if I had made it to my goal I would only be making 65K right now. After you subtract taxes and other expenses it isn't that great. The people whom I know who have made it to what was once considered a great job are now calling me for advise on how to start their own construction business.
I worked for National Airlines, Horizon Airlines and a prominent Northwest Charter company. Before that it was 7 years of Alaskan bush flying for various operators.
Had I stayed at Horizon I would be making 50 after 8 years with the company. If I had stayed with the big jet charter outfit I would be making around 45K as a Lear/Challenger captain by now. At the time National was considered the favorite over JB and payed it captains 55K.
None of those jobs were that good. In fact I envied the rampers when I was at Horizon because the company treated them better than the pilots. My career was no different than most other peoples. I know a guy who flies for SWA and lives in a camper in a huge gravel parking lot neat the Baltimore airport since he is on reserve. The good times are mostly gone in the airlines now. Sure there are a few single guys who are having a blast. They don't mind being gone all the time and hotels are great since you don't have to clean them. It is a different story for families who need a real income and need you to be home more.
If you are single and don't have a life otherwise you might be alright at 24K or even at 48K. As I mentioned before most of us became pilots to have a better life and to earn more than the average guy. It takes at least 100K for a family of four to live a middle class lifestyle in the big city right now and 150 to 200K to make it to upper middle class. 48K is an embarrassment, it is a poverty wage. You can't properly support a family on that.
You probably will not understand until you have a family of your own who is crammed into a 2 bedroom apartment in a slummy area and you are leaving them to go on another 5 day trip after being back for only 2 days. What fun! This profession was once truly great, lots of time off huge paychecks respect from management, now it is just an OK job and sinking into a horrible one. Even the majors are not that appealing anymore. My generation signed up for great.
SkyHigh
12-19-2005, 07:52 AM
#29
Self Employed.
Thread Starter
Joined APC: May 2005
Position: Corporate Pilot
Posts: 7,119
ChrisH
ChrisH
You don't have to take my word for it. Why don't you move your ideas up to the regionals/majors pages and hear what Kill Bill and the others have to say? I am not just a single crazy dude. The others have stronger opinions than I. Sure you might find a positive guy or two in aviation, but If you look around you will see that most are just like me. Why if you look carefully at concentration camp pictures from WW2 there are a few people in the group who are smiling.
You seem to only look for examples and situations that support your idea of what the industry is like. You are ignoring the facts and overlooking the average experiences of most pilots. You should look at the down sides too. Most do not upgrade in 2 years. Most spend 5 years waiting to get on with a regional. Most do not make it to a major airline. Most are furloughed or laid off three times in a career. Not fun !
Read the thread about Ryan Air and the future of american the airline industry. Scary stuff.
SkyHigh
You don't have to take my word for it. Why don't you move your ideas up to the regionals/majors pages and hear what Kill Bill and the others have to say? I am not just a single crazy dude. The others have stronger opinions than I. Sure you might find a positive guy or two in aviation, but If you look around you will see that most are just like me. Why if you look carefully at concentration camp pictures from WW2 there are a few people in the group who are smiling.
You seem to only look for examples and situations that support your idea of what the industry is like. You are ignoring the facts and overlooking the average experiences of most pilots. You should look at the down sides too. Most do not upgrade in 2 years. Most spend 5 years waiting to get on with a regional. Most do not make it to a major airline. Most are furloughed or laid off three times in a career. Not fun !
Read the thread about Ryan Air and the future of american the airline industry. Scary stuff.
SkyHigh
12-19-2005, 09:33 AM
#30
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2005
Posts: 184
SkyHigh,
It is not all fun and glamour; I realize that. I understand that others share your view, and I certainly don't think anything bad of you for your views. I don't think you are crazy for one second.
My views are a bit on the idealistic side, but flying is all I've ever wanted to do, so I like to keep a positive attitude. I am certainly aware of the problems with the industry right now.
I know that $30K is not a great salary for a 2nd year FO. I have just not looked into any other careers I would be interested in, nor are any of my friends who are outside of aviation, getting jobs that are starting much more than that. That is working anywhere from marketing to being in computers. Sure there are jobs that pay more than that starting; just not many I am interested in.
As far as upgrades; it depends on the airline, but the average seems to be between 2 to 4 years, so I just say 3. Obviously some take more, and others a little less, but that is changing all of the time.
I don't know what your ultimate goal flying was that would have you making $65K as a CA right now. A first year CA with ExpressJet makes $53K on the ERJ145, and that is flying just the 75 hour minimum, and does not include per diem. I believe in another thread, superpilot92, who flies for ExJet, said he, in his first year as an FO, will make $4,800 in per diem, and that is with not flying a lot. Lets add that to the $53K, and factor in that he may fly over 75 hours. A first year ExJet CA has the potential to make close to $60K, or more.
Is the above a GREAT salary? No, but it isn't bad for a young pilot, who is still overall new to the industry, and in his first year as a CA. Also, a first or second year FO at places like SWA, UPS, FedEx, etc., will make above $65K. Even at AirTran and JetBlue, two majors who some believe are lowering the pay bar, a first year CA will make $90-$100K, only flying the minimum, not including per diem.
It is not all fun and glamour; I realize that. I understand that others share your view, and I certainly don't think anything bad of you for your views. I don't think you are crazy for one second.
My views are a bit on the idealistic side, but flying is all I've ever wanted to do, so I like to keep a positive attitude. I am certainly aware of the problems with the industry right now.
I know that $30K is not a great salary for a 2nd year FO. I have just not looked into any other careers I would be interested in, nor are any of my friends who are outside of aviation, getting jobs that are starting much more than that. That is working anywhere from marketing to being in computers. Sure there are jobs that pay more than that starting; just not many I am interested in.
As far as upgrades; it depends on the airline, but the average seems to be between 2 to 4 years, so I just say 3. Obviously some take more, and others a little less, but that is changing all of the time.
I don't know what your ultimate goal flying was that would have you making $65K as a CA right now. A first year CA with ExpressJet makes $53K on the ERJ145, and that is flying just the 75 hour minimum, and does not include per diem. I believe in another thread, superpilot92, who flies for ExJet, said he, in his first year as an FO, will make $4,800 in per diem, and that is with not flying a lot. Lets add that to the $53K, and factor in that he may fly over 75 hours. A first year ExJet CA has the potential to make close to $60K, or more.
Is the above a GREAT salary? No, but it isn't bad for a young pilot, who is still overall new to the industry, and in his first year as a CA. Also, a first or second year FO at places like SWA, UPS, FedEx, etc., will make above $65K. Even at AirTran and JetBlue, two majors who some believe are lowering the pay bar, a first year CA will make $90-$100K, only flying the minimum, not including per diem.
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