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Trump to announce ATC privatization

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Old 06-06-2017, 09:07 AM
  #11  
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Here's one of the few informative articles the USA Today has put out.

It's a breakdown of fees and taxes, but more importantly the myriad of government agencies that keep air travel moving. I can't imagine cost effectiveness and efficiency being the byproduct of only ATC privatization. You'll still have silos, but silos under different management: government and non-government.

The real 800lb gorilla with this effort is what happens to the balance of the aviation trust fund?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/trave...axes/29518427/

So the question remains, will privatization make air travel safer and less expensive to users. If so, how?
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Old 06-06-2017, 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted by awax
Here's one of the few informative articles the USA Today has put out.

It's a breakdown of fees and taxes, but more importantly the myriad of government agencies that keep air travel moving. I can't imagine cost effectiveness and efficiency being the byproduct of only ATC privatization. You'll still have silos, but silos under different management: government and non-government.

The real 800lb gorilla with this effort is what happens to the balance of the aviation trust fund?

https://www.usatoday.com/story/trave...axes/29518427/

So the question remains, will privatization make air travel safer and less expensive to users. If so, how?
Just some random brainstorming in response to your question:

1. Privatized, competing control centers would have an incentive to offer faster, less expensive service to traffic. It is likely that airlines would seek means to influence ATC fees and services to their competitive advantage. The end result would be lower ticket prices and better on-time performance for the airlines most successful at such negotiation.

2. If airport/TRACON control becomes operated by competing companies, Charlotte TRACON could directly compete with Atlanta TRACON, for example. This will, similarly to the above example, drive the ATC operator to please the major airline most invested in that hub. Such behavior would likely cause further entrenchment of regional market shares. Whether this is a good thing for the consumer remains to be seen.

3. This is the part that pilots hate: Privatization is likely to reduce activity among smaller operators and GA who currently pay no visible per-flight fees. It may result in decreases in service to small communities served by lower-capacity aircraft. Or.....it may not. Private ATC operators might offer different rates to smaller aircraft or even compete for their business much in the same way as do FBOs. There are already landing fees at some airports, and those airports as a result see a lower amount of GA activity. Operators would be aware of this. Those companies seeking to specialize into serving smaller communities or the GA world would be likely to adjust their fee structure accordingly.



All of the above assumes a laissez-faire free-market ATC system, of course. That's not likely to happen under the privatization scheme most popular with lawmakers. Just some ideas about what might happen if we truly went to that extreme.
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Old 06-06-2017, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Flightcap



All of the above assumes a laissez-faire free-market ATC system, of course. That's not likely to happen under the privatization scheme most popular with lawmakers. Just some ideas about what might happen if we truly went to that extreme.
That's my fear too, it will be the worst of both worlds: a bloated government bureaucracy with too many regulations, coupled with a monopolistic bloated corporate entity on top of it.
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Old 06-07-2017, 08:57 AM
  #14  
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About friggin time.

Originally Posted by NatGeo
It looks like it is time for us to write letters to our congressman.

I wonder how many of the pilots who voted for Trump, think that User Fees/ Privatizing ATC is a good development for our industry.

Good old Israli Hedge Funder Karl Icahn is looking out for the aviation industry. He is the same guy who gave the ponzi scheme company Herballife a lifeline when they were on the brink of going under.
It is good for the industry. Many pilot unions and airlines support this. It's only big government types who don't.

This has worked both in Canada and Europe, best thing of all is that it gets rid of the horrible pension aspect of government workers.
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Lemons
About friggin time.



It is good for the industry. Many pilot unions and airlines support this. It's only big government types who don't.

This has worked both in Canada and Europe, best thing of all is that it gets rid of the horrible pension aspect of government workers.

It has been a disaster in Australia. It would have a negative impact on controllers compensation/ benefits. Not as many talented people would be attracted to that profession.

It would increase the barriers to entry to becoming a commercial pilot, or even to those who just want to get their private.

I think it comes down to common sense. What Trump/Icahn industry deal would ever result in better conditions/ compensation for those in that industry?
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by NatGeo
It has been a disaster in Australia. It would have a negative impact on controllers compensation/ benefits. Not as many talented people would be attracted to that profession.

It would increase the barriers to entry to becoming a commercial pilot, or even to those who just want to get their private.

I think it comes down to common sense. What Trump/Icahn industry deal would ever result in better conditions/ compensation for those in that industry?
Who cares about the controllers, this is about building a better system.
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Old 06-07-2017, 10:34 AM
  #17  
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I've yet to hear anybody articulate exactly how privatized ATC would be "better" than the existing system.
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Old 06-07-2017, 04:09 PM
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Originally Posted by BoilerUP
I've yet to hear anybody articulate exactly how privatized ATC would be "better" than the existing system.
If it were truly private (as opposed to a government-partnership monopoly type thing) then there would be competition and downward pressure on prices. That means efficiency would increase as would customer service. Right now the FAA doesn't care how many planes they control. However a profit motive would drive a company to make much more efficient use out of the airspace. There is of course a point of diminishing returns as too much "efficiency" and safety becomes sacrificed. But we are a looooong way from that point currently.
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Old 06-09-2017, 08:04 AM
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Originally Posted by BoilerUP
I've yet to hear anybody articulate exactly how privatized ATC would be "better" than the existing system.
It would take more workers of the government payroll. No pensions the government would have to pay and less power to the union.
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Old 06-09-2017, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Lemons
It would take more workers of the government payroll. No pensions the government would have to pay and less power to the union.
That doesn't articulate how private ATC would be "better"...only cheaper. And it is arguable that privatized would actually be less expensive, given the FAA's total 2015 budget was $15.7B and Airport & Airway Trust Fund revenues (paid directly by users in the form of fuel excise taxes and ticket fees) for 2015 were north of $14.5B.

I hear plenty of propaganda talk about reducing delays...but nobody has explained exactly how privatization would lead to a reduction in delays.

I generally prefer smaller, more efficient government but the reality is government does actually do some things well and providing ATC services for the busiest airspace in the world is one of those things.

After the PPACA, I'm surprised that some people of opposing ideology are so quick to go jacking around with something that has such a significant impact on the national economy...
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