sulkair

Dang Barley, did someone TPIC in your Cherrios? It's kind of ironic how the point you're trying to make is getting buried in the noise of your own language. "Guessing you got hired low time and upgraded quickly" "Folks unable to think" "Wet Dream" "Time to grow up" You kind of seem bitter about something.

Normally your posts are illuminative and less angry - what gives man?

Barley

Haha I know. But it's just blatant regurgitated ignorance. I just see things for how they are and not veiled behind the curtain of ego. I'm sure Aero1900 is a great person to fly with, but to suggest that his experience is more valuable than others that didn't get here the same way is kind of ridiculous. I didn't feel like I was in a totally new job when I upgraded, but then again I was an FO for over 6,000 hours and flew pistons for 2,000 before that. It's all mostly arbitrary.

We all get the same type rating. We all have varied experience. And we're (mostly) all at F9 because we enjoy working with each other and share a common goal. Let's not mix up the flight decks with this silly stuff. I am always shaking my head when I hear this stuff regarding TPIC, race, gender, college, etc.. It needs to stop.

sulkair

That's better...Sold! You had me at "curtain of ego." And who could possibly disagree with your last paragraph - good stuff

Aero1900

All I'm saying is that the captain and the FO have a different job, different responsibilities and usually a different mindset. I'm not saying that captains are better pilots than FOs. I'm not saying that someone who has never been a captain is not a great pilot. I'm simply saying that being a captain is different and I don't think it's a completely worthless experience as you seem to imply. I learned a lot being a captain and I'd like to think that experience is a benefit now. Airlines seeking guys with PIC time seems logical to me. However, virtually every airline hires guys without TPIC time, so obviously they believe that those guys will also make valuable pilots.

Just for reference, in my new hire class at Frontier, of the 12 of us, I believe 4 had no TPIC time.

Aero1900

And to bring the topic back to frontier hiring... Of the twelve people in my class, I think Frontier did a great job selecting friendly people with great attitudes. I really liked everyone in my class, just a great group of people. The Frontier pilot group as a whole is great. So many nice guys and gals.

One thing that has really struck me about this place is how good the attitude of the pilot group is especially considering all the things Frontier has been through. Bankruptcy, pay cuts, Republic ownership, years of total stagnation... And yet everyone still has a great attitude, and still help the flight attendants clean the cabin during quick turns. I find that impressive.

Frontier is growing and hiring.

ManFlex

You guys clean cabins with the flight attendants? Our flight attendants don't even clean cabins at Spirit. Franke must love you guys.

TurboDVR42

Manflex,
I don't think anyone cleans your cabin at NK. It clearly shows

corperalcleg

You obviously don't know about our world class midget cleaners in GUA that make a whopping $1

FAULTPUSH

I mostly agree, in that TPIC is overrated, but not that it's totally arbitrary. In two equally capable applicants, the one with more experience would probably be the safer pilot to hire. There are more important things to look at than flight time; race and gender are meaningless factors for safety, and I think they should be meaningless in the hiring equation too.

One was race, one was race and gender, one was nepotism.

In a safety sensitive position, I think that experience should count for more than race/gender/family. I think that the current race or gender distribution of your flight crews should have no bearing in an airline's hiring decisions.

I agree, but experience can be gained on the job; attitude is tougher to change.

I've been highly impressed with almost everybody we've hired since the new process started back in about 2004. With maybe two exceptions, they've had great attitudes, and will go the extra mile to help out. That's far more important to me than PIC time.

ManFlex

Well played sir!