sulkair

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NWSteeringArmer

The company has decided to delay the next round of negotiations until May 6 so they can "discuss" these new rates... Basiclly that means they're going to say give up anything that makes this place worth working for and you can have your rates... By the time this is all said and done well be 3 contracts behind everyone else... I get why they're doing it but if they keep pinching the purse strings, they're going to make it impossible to hire/keep anyone worth working with... A sad state of affairs

And I'd say, if it weren't for the RLA, 85+% of the pilots here would go on strike tomorrow

PulledBreaker

I'm a 135/corporate guy, so forgive my ignorance....but what do you think management wants the pilots to give up in exchange for higher pay rates? I'm trying to do as much research as possible before committing to the 24 month contract.

OpenClimb

Could be anything they perceive as inconvenient or expensive. The sky is the limit. No pun intended, but it kinda worked out.

I wouldn't want to give them any ideas by being more specific and would respectfully suggest that others take this into consideration if you choose to respond.

AncientAliens

I mean no disrespect when I say this but don't be naive. This is what management does for a living. We decode NOTAMs and shoot approaches. They negotiate contracts. Nothing anyone will post on here hasn't already crossed their minds.

Regarding the previously posted pay scale LOA stands for "Letter of Agreement". If my memory serves correctly there are about 90 LOAs attached to our contract. This is why there is so much confusion when someone asks for our current payscale.

LOA 67 was a concessionary agreement between the union and Republic during the 2011 bankruptcy. Among other items (401k matching, vacation/sick accrual, longevity) the agreement necessitated paycuts by transitioning to alternative less lucrative pay scales. There are numerous payscales in our CBA and trying to figure out which one we currently operate under requires reading through several of the LOAs. As part of LOA 67 the union negotiated for mandatory pay snapbacks to occur each year starting in 2015 should the company obtain a pretax profit of greater than 5%. These SnapBacks occurred on 4/1 in 2015/16 and another one is scheduled for 1/1/17. The pay increases themselves are mostly negligible (2-3%) but there is another provision that requires the company to engage in "good faith upward pay negotiations" should favorable business conditions exist. The payscale posted a couple pages back is the union's proposal to satisfy that requirement under our current contract. It has to do with the section 6 negotiations currently underway for our next contract.

For Indigo this is a zero sum game, every penny they concede in rates, work rules etc. is going to come out of their pocket when IPO time roles around. They literally aren't in the business of building a vibrant company. They flip businesses, that's it. Everything from now until we go public is an attempt to improve the balance sheet in order to increase F9's valuation.

Our only leverage is a strike which the company knows is a minimum of 3-4 years away. Until then they will continue to reap the competitive advantages of a labor group that is paid 30-60% less than their peers.

That being said, this is still a decent place to work. In two years here I can't recall not being able to get a single day that I needed off. Ive never had less than 15 days off in a month and most months will get 17 or more.
While QOL is pretty good, I'd say that 80% of the pilot group under the age of 45 would still leave for a legacy. Until we get a management group that decides to treat its customers and employees with anything other than disdain and indifference this place will continue to be a revolving door at the lower levels, hence the implementation of a training contract.

NWSteeringArmer

The company has made it blatantly obvious what they want us to give up... Hell, they wanted to basically do away with the hotel committee completely... If you want to work here, I would do my research... I'd talk to people who work here... That should tell you all you need to know

ClearCreek

Frontier Sucks.

1. The pay.

2. The hotels.

3. The flying.

4. Management.

5. The pilot group.

I write this as a 1 year employee. The pay is stupid here. Expect $900 checks every two weeks for your first year. You might hit a good month or get rolled. In that case you might get $1200. There is nothing in open time. Yes, most people get the base of their choice after a couple months and a line. Trust me, its not that cool.

2. Do you enjoy having fun on your overnights? Downtown hotels? Don't come here. We stay by the airport. No matter what, regardless of overnight duration. A good overnight at Frontier has a gas station and an Applebees.

3. Redeyes are unavoidable. Unless you are a bid ninja or glued to the computer you will fly redeyes. A lot of non redeye flying gets you in late at night and out early. Combine that with crummy hotels...

4. Management has made it very clear that any gains will be hard fought. Assuming a contract will pass, it'll be years. Get ready for a multi-year fight for another industry bottom POS.

5. This is most important. Frontier pilots are whipped. Starting the APU is considered an act of rebellion. We have a good group but 10 years of beatings have had their effect.

I understand anyone that wants to get out of the regionals. Just be very careful coming here. Get the type and get out. I think Frontier will be a sad case until we get swallowed up by someone else.

GangtaMoose

thank you for the clarification.

ULLI

@clearcreek, you are very angry little man.

ClearCreek

How am I wrong? I'm not the tallest guy. I am a little angry though. Every Frontier employee should be.