Frontier Hiring.
#2591
Commutes to work
Joined APC: Jan 2014
Posts: 86
Do you really give a **** about the color? You should worry about being the lowest paid Airbus pilots and if a merger does happen, how much harder it will be for everyone to get better pay considering how far we both would have to come if you average our (Spirits low pay as well as your horrendous pay?)
Hope it never becomes an issue and we never merge but if we do, I sure as **** don't care what they call us or what color our airplanes are
Hope it never becomes an issue and we never merge but if we do, I sure as **** don't care what they call us or what color our airplanes are
Thx for your well thought out response. Glad you decided it better to put down someone else's opinion instead of using your time for intellectual discussion. I didn't realize I, or anyone, had to check with you but in the future you can expect my PM for reassurance that it's ok to post.
#2592
Do you really give a **** about the color? You should worry about being the lowest paid Airbus pilots and if a merger does happen, how much harder it will be for everyone to get better pay considering how far we both would have to come if you average our (Spirits low pay as well as your horrendous pay?)
Hope it never becomes an issue and we never merge but if we do, I sure as **** don't care what they call us or what color our airplanes are
Hope it never becomes an issue and we never merge but if we do, I sure as **** don't care what they call us or what color our airplanes are
First of all thank you for stopping by F9 thread and sharing your wisdom with us. We did not realize we were underpaid. Also why do you think Frontier has a new paint job? Just so our pilots can be happy flying a pretty airplanes (sarcasm BTW, since you did not get the yellow banana one).
I don't think anyone at Frontier wants to be associated with NK. The only single positive thing that can come from that merge is a faster newer, better CBA. Even than that's not guaranteed. Negotiations start next March, hopefully you boys will have signed a contract so we can aim for something higher.
See you next time when you decide to troll back in
#2593
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2010
Posts: 675
I'd vote a big fat NO on any merger. But, Mr. Franke probably won't ask for my 2 cents in a billion dollar plus deal like that. Here's some interesting math though:
Mergered today the "new" airline would have 128 airframes. Spirit's orders, plus Frontiers orders scheduled by the end of the decade would bring the fleet to 328, accord to numbers found on APC (I can only confirm F9's orders.)
Both airlines are operating around 13 hrs a day, which equates to 10-ish crews per plane. 328 airplanes = 6,560 pilots plus a 30% reserve staffing = 8,528 pilots to staff a combined airline by 2021. The total list right now would be 2,000 pilots.
Mergered today the "new" airline would have 128 airframes. Spirit's orders, plus Frontiers orders scheduled by the end of the decade would bring the fleet to 328, accord to numbers found on APC (I can only confirm F9's orders.)
Both airlines are operating around 13 hrs a day, which equates to 10-ish crews per plane. 328 airplanes = 6,560 pilots plus a 30% reserve staffing = 8,528 pilots to staff a combined airline by 2021. The total list right now would be 2,000 pilots.
#2594
On Reserve
Joined APC: Apr 2015
Position: Airbus Driver
Posts: 24
Smoke, I don't know. I guess all those numbers are based off 13 hours a day and 10 crews per plane. Maybe with all those deliveries there wouldn't be a need to fly each airplane as much? Reduce utilization and the staffing numbers obviously go down. Time will tell, I suppose.
#2596
This conversation got a little unnecessarily heated...I work for F9, I have a lot of friends that work for Spirit. I think a merger would benefit both sides, both would gain aircraft and new destinations, and we could try to negotiate a CBA that pulled from both of our contracts strengths. Yes we do have some golden nuggets in our cba, even though we are underpaid! I think a merged spirit/frontier company would be in a better position to compete, but maybe I'm wrong. I suppose in time this will all play out and we'll see.
#2597
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2012
Position: 1900D CA
Posts: 3,476
it's all about that stock price
Keep in mind that virtually all the decisions made by management are designed to raise the stock price and increase the profit margin.
Frontier will ipo well before any merger. Indigo might as well be called ipo. After the ipo they can watch what the stock price does and then evaluate a merger. If the stock price does well, there's no rush to merge. If the stock price disapoints, I bet they start talking merger. Pubic talk of mergers always drives up stock prices.
I still say we aren't going public this fall. It's too soon. I know I'm in the minority on that, but I really don't think we go public nearly that soon.
I predict that we do merge with spirit, but it's at least 5 years off. When/if it does happen it sure could create a big airline. I think that the order book of Buses is so big that all non NEO airplanes will go away. Both airlines have very aggressive growth plans and I highly doubt that all that combined growth could happen. The US market simply can't support a 700 airplane SWA and a 350 airplane "Spirit of Frontier" in addition to the legacies.
Perhaps the combined airlines growth would sputter out at 200ish airframes?? I don't think the ULCC model will be able to grow as big as it has in Europe with Southwest here. I think the ULCCs in Europe have grown to 30% of the market. I don't think we'll have that here so long as Southwest continues to do well.
From the pilots perspective, I think a merger is a good thing. I think we are stronger together than apart. Hopefully both airlines can sign new, better contracts before any merger so that we can continue to aim higher. I sincerely wish spirit pilots the best in their contract negotiations. Raise the bar!
Frontier will ipo well before any merger. Indigo might as well be called ipo. After the ipo they can watch what the stock price does and then evaluate a merger. If the stock price does well, there's no rush to merge. If the stock price disapoints, I bet they start talking merger. Pubic talk of mergers always drives up stock prices.
I still say we aren't going public this fall. It's too soon. I know I'm in the minority on that, but I really don't think we go public nearly that soon.
I predict that we do merge with spirit, but it's at least 5 years off. When/if it does happen it sure could create a big airline. I think that the order book of Buses is so big that all non NEO airplanes will go away. Both airlines have very aggressive growth plans and I highly doubt that all that combined growth could happen. The US market simply can't support a 700 airplane SWA and a 350 airplane "Spirit of Frontier" in addition to the legacies.
Perhaps the combined airlines growth would sputter out at 200ish airframes?? I don't think the ULCC model will be able to grow as big as it has in Europe with Southwest here. I think the ULCCs in Europe have grown to 30% of the market. I don't think we'll have that here so long as Southwest continues to do well.
From the pilots perspective, I think a merger is a good thing. I think we are stronger together than apart. Hopefully both airlines can sign new, better contracts before any merger so that we can continue to aim higher. I sincerely wish spirit pilots the best in their contract negotiations. Raise the bar!
#2599
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: Narrow/Left Wide/Right
Posts: 3,655
79 hours of credit in 13 days on work isn't too bad. That's over 6hrs a day, better than Deltas 5:15 avg daily guarantee. Touche
#2600
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2008
Position: Airbus F/O
Posts: 333
This is why I would bet we IPO this fall. our contract is coming due in 2017 with the potential to open it in 2016. Indigo is known for not being kind when it comes to labor negotiations. Investors are always hesitant during labor disputes. So this only leaves two choices, IPO early in order to not have labor negotiations and attract investors, or IPO when the contract comes due, which would mean that indigo would want to resolve the contract pronto in order to not have labor negotiations. Which would you opt for if you were Indigo?
I would also guess IPO now, when contract comes due, the stock may go down a bit opening the door for the merger with Spirit.
I would also guess IPO now, when contract comes due, the stock may go down a bit opening the door for the merger with Spirit.
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