Frontier Negotiations Discussion
12-04-2018, 06:50 AM
#3932
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Lineholder
Posts: 1,442
The longer we take on a new TA = The longer we work under the old one. It doesn't take a labor attorney to understand that. You may want to take a course in economics as well.
I am not willing to take "anything offered". I am putting faith in our NC members and willing to give them a chance to present what I believe is going to be a good deal. You on the other hand are acting hysterical and it is kinda irritating.
I am not willing to take "anything offered". I am putting faith in our NC members and willing to give them a chance to present what I believe is going to be a good deal. You on the other hand are acting hysterical and it is kinda irritating.
If we go back the bargaining table in 2021 vs 2023, we spend a shorter amount of time with THIS contract. It also gives the market a chance to increase its value as most if not all the other airlines will renegotiate their contracts in the meantime.
If we continue to accept bottom industry contracts and negotiate new ones every 5 years, we will stay at the bottom no matter how many contracts we negotiate. In 2050, 2100 and so on, we’ll still be at the bottom.
Sooner or later you need to break the cycle of 5 yr contracts. JBs is 4 years - why can’t we get a 3 yr one? Especially when you consider that it’s the cheapest in the industry.
I know there’s a fear. You’ve gotta be bigger than that fear. It really just comes down to facing that fear and deciding to help yourself (and others) down the road.
12-04-2018, 07:14 AM
#3933
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Position: Swing that gear
Posts: 354
Just because an airline is negotiating a new contract doesn’t mean they will be getting a huge raise. Contract improvements happen when times are good and your timeline means your at the table. We are in a very long duration of good times and that’s why we are so far behind.
I’m not saying the sky is falling in the industry now, or next week but the people that think you will get a major raise with each contract have forgotten 15-18 years ago. It’s a cycle.
I’m not saying the sky is falling in the industry now, or next week but the people that think you will get a major raise with each contract have forgotten 15-18 years ago. It’s a cycle.
12-04-2018, 07:53 AM
#3934
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2018
Posts: 146
Not trying to be insulting but shorter contract duration means higher pay down the road.
If we go back the bargaining table in 2021 vs 2023, we spend a shorter amount of time with THIS contract. It also gives the market a chance to increase its value as most if not all the other airlines will renegotiate their contracts in the meantime.
If we continue to accept bottom industry contracts and negotiate new ones every 5 years, we will stay at the bottom no matter how many contracts we negotiate. In 2050, 2100 and so on, we’ll still be at the bottom.
Sooner or later you need to break the cycle of 5 yr contracts. JBs is 4 years - why can’t we get a 3 yr one? Especially when you consider that it’s the cheapest in the industry.
I know there’s a fear. You’ve gotta be bigger than that fear. It really just comes down to facing that fear and deciding to help yourself (and others) down the road.
If we go back the bargaining table in 2021 vs 2023, we spend a shorter amount of time with THIS contract. It also gives the market a chance to increase its value as most if not all the other airlines will renegotiate their contracts in the meantime.
If we continue to accept bottom industry contracts and negotiate new ones every 5 years, we will stay at the bottom no matter how many contracts we negotiate. In 2050, 2100 and so on, we’ll still be at the bottom.
Sooner or later you need to break the cycle of 5 yr contracts. JBs is 4 years - why can’t we get a 3 yr one? Especially when you consider that it’s the cheapest in the industry.
I know there’s a fear. You’ve gotta be bigger than that fear. It really just comes down to facing that fear and deciding to help yourself (and others) down the road.
12-04-2018, 07:58 AM
#3935
Banned
Joined APC: Aug 2018
Posts: 330
Not trying to be insulting but shorter contract duration means higher pay down the road.
If we go back the bargaining table in 2021 vs 2023, we spend a shorter amount of time with THIS contract. It also gives the market a chance to increase its value as most if not all the other airlines will renegotiate their contracts in the meantime.
If we continue to accept bottom industry contracts and negotiate new ones every 5 years, we will stay at the bottom no matter how many contracts we negotiate. In 2050, 2100 and so on, we’ll still be at the bottom.
Sooner or later you need to break the cycle of 5 yr contracts. JBs is 4 years - why can’t we get a 3 yr one? Especially when you consider that it’s the cheapest in the industry.
I know there’s a fear. You’ve gotta be bigger than that fear. It really just comes down to facing that fear and deciding to help yourself (and others) down the road.
If we go back the bargaining table in 2021 vs 2023, we spend a shorter amount of time with THIS contract. It also gives the market a chance to increase its value as most if not all the other airlines will renegotiate their contracts in the meantime.
If we continue to accept bottom industry contracts and negotiate new ones every 5 years, we will stay at the bottom no matter how many contracts we negotiate. In 2050, 2100 and so on, we’ll still be at the bottom.
Sooner or later you need to break the cycle of 5 yr contracts. JBs is 4 years - why can’t we get a 3 yr one? Especially when you consider that it’s the cheapest in the industry.
I know there’s a fear. You’ve gotta be bigger than that fear. It really just comes down to facing that fear and deciding to help yourself (and others) down the road.
12-04-2018, 09:07 AM
#3937
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Lineholder
Posts: 1,442
Just because an airline is negotiating a new contract doesn’t mean they will be getting a huge raise. Contract improvements happen when times are good and your timeline means your at the table. We are in a very long duration of good times and that’s why we are so far behind.
I’m not saying the sky is falling in the industry now, or next week but the people that think you will get a major raise with each contract have forgotten 15-18 years ago. It’s a cycle.
I’m not saying the sky is falling in the industry now, or next week but the people that think you will get a major raise with each contract have forgotten 15-18 years ago. It’s a cycle.
If there were another 9/11 event, then of course, ALL airlines would snap into immediate concessionary contract negotiations (just like last time). Interesting how when times are bad, no company waits to negotiate (and take a greater loss) but Indigo stiff arms our negotiations to the last second. And then, wants to get that contract in place for as long as possible.
Why do you think that is?
12-04-2018, 09:19 AM
#3938
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Position: Swing that gear
Posts: 354
I think there is a few things going on in the background. We have all heard what they could be... time will tell.
I haven’t confirmed with a rep but doing the math from the bullet points has DOS +1 3/19. 5 year contract then ends 3/23. 6 month early opener means we can start again 9/22. 3 years 10 months from now.
I can justify my prelim no vote for other reasons but not duration.
I haven’t confirmed with a rep but doing the math from the bullet points has DOS +1 3/19. 5 year contract then ends 3/23. 6 month early opener means we can start again 9/22. 3 years 10 months from now.
I can justify my prelim no vote for other reasons but not duration.
12-04-2018, 09:22 AM
#3939
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Lineholder
Posts: 1,442
I think there is a few things going on in the background. We have all heard what they could be... time will tell.
I haven’t confirmed with a rep but doing the math from the bullet points has DOS +1 3/19. 5 year contract then ends 3/23. 6 month early opener means we can start again 9/22. 3 years 10 months from now.
I can justify my prelim no vote for other reasons but not duration.
I haven’t confirmed with a rep but doing the math from the bullet points has DOS +1 3/19. 5 year contract then ends 3/23. 6 month early opener means we can start again 9/22. 3 years 10 months from now.
I can justify my prelim no vote for other reasons but not duration.
Which do you think is better? Keep in mind, we've been in negotiations already for over 2 years.
SOONER OR LATER, the cycle of us being behind needs to be broken. Voting yes now ensures it will be later. Perhaps instead of orange lanyards we need T-shirts that say "Into the pattern?" with a pic of a big boot kicking a can...
12-04-2018, 10:33 AM
#3940
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2016
Posts: 617
I think there is a few things going on in the background. We have all heard what they could be... time will tell.
I haven’t confirmed with a rep but doing the math from the bullet points has DOS +1 3/19. 5 year contract then ends 3/23. 6 month early opener means we can start again 9/22. 3 years 10 months from now.
I can justify my prelim no vote for other reasons but not duration.
I haven’t confirmed with a rep but doing the math from the bullet points has DOS +1 3/19. 5 year contract then ends 3/23. 6 month early opener means we can start again 9/22. 3 years 10 months from now.
I can justify my prelim no vote for other reasons but not duration.
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