Powderkeg

Welcome back, Bus. I’ll second what you said. Also I’ll add the Company has our demands. If the Company isn’t meeting those demands then it’s their choice to continue to struggle to hire/grow/IPO/sell/merge.

To remind all of you bantering about PBS, those demands were market comparable pay and retirement, industry standard scope and scheduling/work rules preservation. Anything less than that is a non-starter from our NC and MEC. Recently I spoke with an MEC member and I was told there is a price for everything, including PBS. Our most recent ask is based on line bidding. We all know the Company isn’t going to cough up any more than that just to get PBS. The likelihood of Indigo being 100% owner of F9 by the time the cost savings of PBS are realized is low. Their out of left field request for PBS was/is nothing more than stall tactics.

The rumors are flying that the company wants a deal. There are NO deals. NO favors. NO concessions are required. Our demands are clear and I know if they aren’t met our MEC will never show us a TA.

OpenClimb

This is exactly the crux of the issue. I've never worked under a PBS system, but I've known folks who have.

I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with PBS. It's kinda like a baseball bat. In the right hands, it provides entertainment for millions of people; in the wrong hands, it can be a deadly weapon.

The folks at F9 have proven that they will use every tool they're given as a means to inflict pain on this pilot group. PBS gives them additional tools. In this case, I believe past history can be a great indicator of future actions.

F9 management needs to show this pilot group they can be trusted with a whiffle bat before we give them a Louisville Slugger with pine tar to end of the barrel.

Maybe we should consider it in 7 years when we're negotiating our next contract.

SeaRider

THIS!! ^^^^^



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fcoolaiddrinker

Completely agree. Either of these two have any input at all I am a no. Don't care what the pay rates are. Statue que would be better IMO.

symbian simian

I have no bone in this fight, but having worked for Indigo I definitely understand the trust issue. Having said that, for us PBS will only replace line bidding. All the schedule adjustment periods and required reserve over-coverage will stay the same (except reserve drop), so we "should" keep our schedule flexibility. Getting that in writing is the hard part.

fcoolaiddrinker

The key for us to maintain Scheduling flexibility under any potential pbs system is the ability to drop to 50 or 60 credit (whatever the final agreed upon language is, as long as its at least 60, anything higher than 60 I am leaning no) INDEPENDENT of the DAG. Without that I would be leaning no. This would be done in a window after your awarded line comes out. Similar to the MOT drop window now.

Gary et al

No, it needs to be a yearly credit requirement, not monthly. The total shall not be greater than an average of 50 credit hours per month or 600 per year. Drops to zero in any given month allowed assuming the coverage is there. Minimum of x% of total credit hours per month from the total are always allowed to be dropped even if reserve coverage is not there as to give the company an minimum amount of staffing they know they must maintain and to protect us from them simply not allowing drops due to staffing.

Monthly limits do not allow total flexibility, a yearly minimum however with certain protections for both the pilots and the company would allow for those occasional times people would like to enjoy a bit more time off without consequence. The problem with the yearly and our current contract is the premium pay over 82. Obviously this would incentivize doing just a few 150 hr months and then being able to take the rest of the year off. So again certain things would have to be adjusted in the language to make a yearly limit acceptable to the company.

fcoolaiddrinker

Sounds even better. A couple questions if you don't mind? how are the minimum of x% of the total credit hours per month that are allowed to be dropped even if the coverage isn't there determined in a month like December? or any other high drop month? seniority? Im not disagreeing with anything you said just trying to understand.

fcoolaiddrinker

I probably wasn't to clear in my first post so ill try to explain better. First, right now there is a fence in flick that won't let you drop below 50 credit. We know we have to finish with 70. Im saying that we need to finish with the 50 (thats our proposal) or 60 at the highest. Remove the fence (or lower it to 30) and let me drop to that new number (independent of dag) in a similar MOT drop window. Then I have to finish with 50 or 60. This gives me the ability drop any potential bad trips or days off I really need that I was awarded through PBS and go from there. This also creates more relief lines and open time. I just don't see much downside? As a side note, I've never used pbs so all I know about it is from what I have read. As we all know reading and working under a contract are two entirely different things. By the way, to my understanding, this is basically what our proposal envisioned minus the PBS of course

XDRVR

We should be able to drop to 0 if there is coverage.