Frontier Negotiations Discussion
04-26-2018, 08:06 AM
#1541
Gets Weekends Off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Lineholder
Posts: 1,442
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
Last edited by dracir1; 04-26-2018 at 08:31 AM.
04-26-2018, 08:37 AM
#1542
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2016
Posts: 443
I'll answer that one...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
04-26-2018, 08:41 AM
#1543
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2013
Posts: 869
I'll answer that one...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
04-26-2018, 11:33 AM
#1544
Slave
Joined APC: Oct 2016
Position: Hot tub
Posts: 1,411
I'll answer that one...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
Strike for industry LEADING...
Indigo will STILL be profiting hundreds of millions per year
04-26-2018, 07:45 PM
#1545
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2010
Position: Fighting the Good fight
Posts: 112
I'll answer that one...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
OK, I've mentioned this elsewhere many times and will mention it again.
OUR HOPES FOR A FAIR AND EQUITABLE CONTRACT lie solely on the NMB allowing us to strike. Period dot. None of this works without that potential event becoming a reality. Right now, we're in a big game of chicken. If we don't get released to a 30 day cooling off period (with the threat of striking afterward), then the company will continue on as they have been and you'd be right about what you wrote above.
So, I'm betting on the come (Vegas guys will know what that means). I'm hoping that the NMB realizes the ridiculousness of our plight and sympathizes. I'm planning for getting released. Mostly because I already know what will be the case if we don't - there's no sense in planning on anything less.
Let's say we DO get released - then what? Well, our work is not over. That's when the REAL negotiations begin. That's when we really get to find out who here at F9 are talkers or walkers. That's when our NC really has to step up and be bold. That's when iteration after iteration of TA gets sent to us and we decide if what's inside is good enough - all while walking in uniform with signs at airports not earning a dime and watching scabs pick up a few routes here and there.
My thoughts are that if we made it that far, if we went all this way and FINALLY got a chance to strike, that we need to see it through all the way to glory. We need to get a well above industry standard/average contract. We need to hold out for better because, as you can imagine, the first REAL offer the company makes isn't the final position they'd be willing to accept. Right now, this company could afford to give $300/hr 12 CA pay w/ SWA work rules and still make money. Pilot labor is by NO WAY the most costly expense - not even close. But, do you think they will offer that in the first TA on day 1 of the strike? I'm not saying we should hold out for THAT specifically (that's just an example), but whatever you and I and everyone else DOES finally decide to vote yes on needs to DAYUM good in our own minds - not just good enough.
So, in order for us to get what we're worth (keep in mind we carry more passengers on our 321s then most 757s and some 767s), then we've got to be prepared to tell the company NO several times. We've got to be able to stomach the process no matter how long it takes. Ultimately, we've got to tell the airline industry that we would rather strike F9 into non-existence than to work for peanuts. This is the most profitable economic times for airlines EVER.
BTW, just think about the impact to recruiting if we got a better contract. Think about your seniority and how it would skyrocket. Think about the # of routes that we could fly with 20, 30 or 40% more pilot labor. Imagine guys leaving Spirt, JB and Alaska or even United to come here...
04-27-2018, 02:28 PM
#1548
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Posts: 290
04-27-2018, 03:32 PM
#1549
Slave
Joined APC: Oct 2016
Position: Hot tub
Posts: 1,411
04-28-2018, 04:58 AM
#1550
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2016
Posts: 550
I'm cautiously optimistic that the NMB will see that ALPA is 100% correct. I'm not saying that the arbitration proffer is imminent, but at this stage there is no other logical objective option.
Here's to a TA in 60 days ladies and gentlemen.
Here's to a TA in 60 days ladies and gentlemen.
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