Instruction in student owned a/c
02-27-2012, 03:28 AM
#2
Moderator
Joined APC: May 2006
Position: ATP, CFI etc.
Posts: 6,056
With the owned airplane you will be responsible for managing it, which adds to the already large cost and effort of getting flight ratings. While owning a trainer is never a bad idea, saving money is not the advantage assuming there are similar rentals around. You can save more by flying less hours, which is under your control. The reason to buy one would have more to do with intending to use it after getting trained to fly it. This is especially true of high performance airplanes where the intention is to use it for business. For the average trainer there is no great advantage to owning it. There may actually be some disadvantage in the sense that otherwise you would be exposed to a wider variety of aircraft.
02-27-2012, 06:53 AM
#3
Prime Minister/Moderator
Joined APC: Jan 2006
Position: Engines Turn Or People Swim
Posts: 40,057
The usual rule-of-thumb for break-even in GA aircraft ownership is 100 hours/year.
If a student intends to earn a Comm/CFI within a year, that might be close to 300 hours wich might justify ownership at first glance.
But you can save additional money when renting by only using the the bare-minimum airplane for the phase of training at hand. Ie C-152 for VFR manuevers/XC, IFR C-172 for IFR, and C-172RG for commercial maneuvers.
If you own, you would either need to own an IFR 172RG, or you would end up renting one for at least some of your training anyway.
Also if you don't plan to keep the airplane, the one-time fees and taxes would probably make ownership for one year a losing proposition.
There's definitely some benefit to flying a variety of airplanes in training, but if you intend to own anyway, know exactly what you will need, and that aircraft will also meet your training needs then it might make sense to buy up front.
If a student intends to earn a Comm/CFI within a year, that might be close to 300 hours wich might justify ownership at first glance.
But you can save additional money when renting by only using the the bare-minimum airplane for the phase of training at hand. Ie C-152 for VFR manuevers/XC, IFR C-172 for IFR, and C-172RG for commercial maneuvers.
If you own, you would either need to own an IFR 172RG, or you would end up renting one for at least some of your training anyway.
Also if you don't plan to keep the airplane, the one-time fees and taxes would probably make ownership for one year a losing proposition.
There's definitely some benefit to flying a variety of airplanes in training, but if you intend to own anyway, know exactly what you will need, and that aircraft will also meet your training needs then it might make sense to buy up front.
02-27-2012, 07:55 AM
#4
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2011
Position: Admiral
Posts: 729
Looking back, I wish I had purchased my own aircraft to do most of my flight training in.
Assuming you are getting your Private Pilot Certificate, Instrument Rating and Commercial Certificates you could very well save money by purchasing your own trainer.
An economical trainer will burn around 8 gal/hr. In my area we pay approximately $5/gal of Avgas. This comes to an hourly operating cost of about $40/hr. An average trainer in my area costs about $125/hr to rent. Based over 250 hours of flight you stand to save upwards of $20,000 by owning your own aircraft.
The above comparison is a very crude comparison, you still have to factor in insurance, maintenance costs, the airplanes annual cost and so on. Also, you won't be able to conduct all of your training in your aircraft as you need a minimum amount of hours in a complex aircraft when going for your Commercial Certificate, or your Multi-Engine Rating. These figures do not include the actual cost of the flight training it's self.
Once you are finished with your flight training, you can sell the aircraft to free up the money you invested into purchasing it.
Assuming you are getting your Private Pilot Certificate, Instrument Rating and Commercial Certificates you could very well save money by purchasing your own trainer.
An economical trainer will burn around 8 gal/hr. In my area we pay approximately $5/gal of Avgas. This comes to an hourly operating cost of about $40/hr. An average trainer in my area costs about $125/hr to rent. Based over 250 hours of flight you stand to save upwards of $20,000 by owning your own aircraft.
The above comparison is a very crude comparison, you still have to factor in insurance, maintenance costs, the airplanes annual cost and so on. Also, you won't be able to conduct all of your training in your aircraft as you need a minimum amount of hours in a complex aircraft when going for your Commercial Certificate, or your Multi-Engine Rating. These figures do not include the actual cost of the flight training it's self.
Once you are finished with your flight training, you can sell the aircraft to free up the money you invested into purchasing it.
02-27-2012, 07:21 PM
#5
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2006
Position: DHC-8 SIC
Posts: 634
I am very tight lipped about using your own aircraft to do initial training. Yes, you could have a great deal by purchasing a nice 150 and then break even or even save a lot of money by selling it once you get all your ratings. However, aircraft unfortunately do break and they cost a lot for maintenance, hanger, insurance, and the list goes on. I know several people in my FBO who own their airplanes and I could say that if you fly at least 100 a year you will break even, but if not you are wasting your money. Also, my suggestion is that you get your PPL by renting and then look at ownership. Again just my .2
02-28-2012, 02:40 AM
#6
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2009
Position: 127.0.0.1
Posts: 2,115
Pros
It's your plane, you fly when you want, not at the mercy of scheduling. There is one plane in my town for rent and weekends fill up fast, but there are at least 5 or 6 CFIIs. You don't have others "learning" and tearing up "your" plane. By flying the same plane, you know it's quirks and instrumentation and may finish up faster. You learn the "joys" of ownership and maintenance costs.
Cons
If it's not the plane you want after training, you are at the mercy of the market when selling/buying. Extra costs - insurance, hangar, annual, reserves (debatable), taxes. May be offset by higher rental costs. If it breaks, you're down until it's fixed, or you pay for a rental. You need to fly different types of a/c.
I wish I had your problem
It's your plane, you fly when you want, not at the mercy of scheduling. There is one plane in my town for rent and weekends fill up fast, but there are at least 5 or 6 CFIIs. You don't have others "learning" and tearing up "your" plane. By flying the same plane, you know it's quirks and instrumentation and may finish up faster. You learn the "joys" of ownership and maintenance costs.
Cons
If it's not the plane you want after training, you are at the mercy of the market when selling/buying. Extra costs - insurance, hangar, annual, reserves (debatable), taxes. May be offset by higher rental costs. If it breaks, you're down until it's fixed, or you pay for a rental. You need to fly different types of a/c.
I wish I had your problem
02-28-2012, 03:57 AM
#7
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Posts: 826
I had a friend who started training with renting. He got tired of cancellations due to maintenance and the generally trashed conditions of trainers. So he bought a 182 and completed his training. Was never sorry for that decision.
Like most other choices, there are upsides and downsides. Your choice is the balance yo make between them.
Like most other choices, there are upsides and downsides. Your choice is the balance yo make between them.
03-01-2012, 02:37 PM
#9
New Hire
Joined APC: Oct 2005
Posts: 5
Looking back, I wish I had purchased my own aircraft to do most of my flight training in.
Assuming you are getting your Private Pilot Certificate, Instrument Rating and Commercial Certificates you could very well save money by purchasing your own trainer.
An economical trainer will burn around 8 gal/hr. In my area we pay approximately $5/gal of Avgas. This comes to an hourly operating cost of about $40/hr. An average trainer in my area costs about $125/hr to rent. Based over 250 hours of flight you stand to save upwards of $20,000 by owning your own aircraft.
The above comparison is a very crude comparison, you still have to factor in insurance, maintenance costs, the airplanes annual cost and so on. Also, you won't be able to conduct all of your training in your aircraft as you need a minimum amount of hours in a complex aircraft when going for your Commercial Certificate, or your Multi-Engine Rating. These figures do not include the actual cost of the flight training it's self.
Once you are finished with your flight training, you can sell the aircraft to free up the money you invested into purchasing it.
Assuming you are getting your Private Pilot Certificate, Instrument Rating and Commercial Certificates you could very well save money by purchasing your own trainer.
An economical trainer will burn around 8 gal/hr. In my area we pay approximately $5/gal of Avgas. This comes to an hourly operating cost of about $40/hr. An average trainer in my area costs about $125/hr to rent. Based over 250 hours of flight you stand to save upwards of $20,000 by owning your own aircraft.
The above comparison is a very crude comparison, you still have to factor in insurance, maintenance costs, the airplanes annual cost and so on. Also, you won't be able to conduct all of your training in your aircraft as you need a minimum amount of hours in a complex aircraft when going for your Commercial Certificate, or your Multi-Engine Rating. These figures do not include the actual cost of the flight training it's self.
Once you are finished with your flight training, you can sell the aircraft to free up the money you invested into purchasing it.
Bought a 1976 C150M for 17k.
Insurance is about $1000 to be named insured
Find an instructor with 300 hours in make and model.
Mighty C150M burns 6.1 gallons per hr.
Figure $45 to $52 per hour for gas, oil, maintenance reserves
O200 has an 1800 TBO, but I've seen many, including mine go past TBO (watch compressions and oil analysis)
Your break even should (WAG) be around 275 hours with the instructor.
After private, radios and install will run you $2.5k to $4k to get the instrument, although the 150 will climb at the astounding rate of 300 to 400 fpm.
Another 100 hours pays for the radios and instructor.
After your instrument, 10 to 15 hours in an arrow, then back to building those hours, btw Florida has lots of sub $5.00/gallon gas, but not for long.
Go in with a few buddies and you really start saving, but you won't be able to dress up in a uniform with awesome wings though.
03-03-2012, 03:14 PM
#10
On Reserve
Joined APC: Mar 2012
Position: '46 Cessna 120
Posts: 11
Buy one!! I bought a 1946 Cessna 120 that burns 4.5GPH. Thats $19.30/hr in fuel costs. 100LL is $4.30 here in Arkansas
Break down of (my) ownership costs:
$800/yr Hangar rental
$1300/yr Insurance
$1250/yr Annual inspection
$1000/yr Random maitnence and parts (if you know an A&P pretty well)
Thats + or - $4350/yr just to own it and keep it flight worthy. This cost would vary depending on unforseen maitnence.
$4837 250hrs worth of fuel
$1600 40hrs dual instruction
If I owned it for 2 years and fly through my commercial in 250hrs I will spend approximately 15k in costs. Throw in another 5k for crap i didnt think about.
If you buy a $25k airplane your spending $45k to get your commercial. Plus you come out of it with an airplane. If it takes a year to sell you have to add almost another 5k in costs to keep it flying.
How much did you spend to get a commercial?
Break down of (my) ownership costs:
$800/yr Hangar rental
$1300/yr Insurance
$1250/yr Annual inspection
$1000/yr Random maitnence and parts (if you know an A&P pretty well)
Thats + or - $4350/yr just to own it and keep it flight worthy. This cost would vary depending on unforseen maitnence.
$4837 250hrs worth of fuel
$1600 40hrs dual instruction
If I owned it for 2 years and fly through my commercial in 250hrs I will spend approximately 15k in costs. Throw in another 5k for crap i didnt think about.
If you buy a $25k airplane your spending $45k to get your commercial. Plus you come out of it with an airplane. If it takes a year to sell you have to add almost another 5k in costs to keep it flying.
How much did you spend to get a commercial?
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