atpwannabe

Save your parents money kid. I graduated from Riddle, DB campus back in 1987. Back then it was different. When you mention to a recruiter or potential employer that you finished Riddle you literally were a shoe-in. Now....that's not the case. If I were you, I'd go to some state university, major in Finance, Software Engineering, or even Hospital Administration plus AFROTC. The Air Force will train you & pay you to learn how to fly. Afterwards....the world's your oyster.


All the best.




atp

USMCFLYR

I wish this were true. Times are too tough for the world to be anyone's oyster in my opinion.

USMCFLYR

Grumble

You're correct in the fact that ERAU is (was when I was there) extremely standardized. You could fly with any instructor and expect the same techniques, answers, etc. Then there were instructors like myself who were sent the problem students. Guys and girls that couldn't seem to master the over complication of bullsht that Riddle puts out. I would teach these studs one on one, to what they needed to pass, no regurgitating the same standardization crap. In the three years there, I only ever had 1 student that just couldn't get to PTS standards. Not to say in anyway they wern't good pilots. Several are now 3000 hour CFI's, Airline pilots, USAF and USMC pilots. They just couldn't learn that way. A fundamental point in the CFI learning process is the different way people learn. ERAU threw that right out the window. Conform or fail.

My opinion was that the school is trying to railroad kids to a commerical way of thinking. A 172 is not a 737, but they try and get kids thinking that way right off the bat and it can be overwhelming. 0-50 hours is not the time to be making stupid altitude callouts, V speeds, etc. Nor is the instrument rating.

The whole process is over the top. the students suffer because the basic fundamentals of good airmanship frequently fall through the cracks amidst the requirements to do freakin stupid crew managment, in a 172 or Seminole. The instructors suffer because they are basically told what to teach. A lot of them never fully understood themselves what it was they were teaching they were just spewing out the standardization.

What use to be a credible University that had a decent rep in the industry has be come a 4 year accredited puppy mill. It cranks out over eductaed, under experienced entry level CFI's that think they deserve to be in the right seat of an RJ, not knowing what they don't know. There is no substitute for 1500 hours. Period dot.

/rant

Wow I really went off on a tangent there, answer your question USMC?

timman19

Class of 1990 here. I couldn't agree with you more. Man, how the times have changed since were students at ERAU...

USMCFLYR

Yes It was quite the rant - but I can understand where the frustration comes from.
I did pick up on those things in a previous post - callouts and flows and such when dealing with a PPL. But I thought maybe I was just old Corps and that was the way the training was conducted in today's environment.
I know that I did not have callouts, flows, etc...
I was taught how to look outside and fly, quite a bit of the 'fly by the seat of your pants' type of stuff actually. Except for a change of controls - I don't really remember any other standardized callouts like I have heard of used in the P121 world.
Training changes flavor over time. Maybe if your plan from day one is too fly in the airlines then training to that *style* from the start has some merit.
Personally - I DID like the whole syllabus styled training at the P141 school that I finshed my PPL training under and got the rest of my ratings. I think it even helped once I went into military flight training - lots of similarities. My P61 flight training seemed disjointed - less structured - and I did not do as well I think.

You and atpwannabe both mention ERAU's reputation in the past. I didn't know too much about these aviation colleges sotell me exactly what these reputations were in the past vice what I read on these boards now. Did they use to be more reasonably priced or have they always been outrageous? Were these colleges the first to bring a stringent standardization to training not before seen in flight schools?

USMCFLYR

Grumble

I had actually never heard of the school until 1994, and the more I found out, the more I wanted to go there. They were kind of ground breaking in the standardization and modeling their program towards what the airlines were looking for. However with the advent of the RJ, and the boom of the late 90's the school subsequently exploded and when quantity went up, quality went down. It really watered down the reputaion of the school, now it's a joke. It use to be "oh you're an ERAU grad?!?!" Now it's "oh... you're and ERAU grad...."

I agree with your points on 141 vs 61. I was a product of both, and have taugh under both. 141 is great, ERAU takes it to 141,000. It's so overboard it's counterproductive. I could KIND of be likened to a military style program, but with no failure. As long as you keep throwing money towards it, they'll keep teaching you, albeit the same stuff. Again, the learn our way or no way mentality.

sukhoikid

I agree with the fact learning call outs, doing briefs, and everything else that riddle standardized takes away from the other stuff. It took me longer because I was not use to it. I was more focus on making the damn right call out than flying the plane... One of my friends got lucky and their instructor didnt make them do call outs or any other the Riddle things to do... that instructor also set him up with a examiner that he knew very well and the examiner didnt care if he did the call outs or what not.

The part i get frustrated I did a great sim last week and the guy was like you didnt say Cruise Check List complete or final items complete and I did but said it in a lower tone voice to myself. He failed me on check list part just for that. Im already halfway done as far as the degree goes... I have my ATC and UAV as a back up at least!!! I see a lot of flight students that dont.....

I really like the school though for the degree. Flight can be frustrating, but I will live through it.

Grumble

You're making my point for me. For any examiner that gave a **** about Riddles stupid procedures, I would ask him to show me where in the PTS that is required. Now if it's an inhouse check-ride, and a 141 syllabus flight, then you're screwed. Their standards and syllabus are approved by the FAA.

An instructor that would bust you on "Cruise check list complete" in a freakin 172 needs a punch in the throat. What cruise check list, pull the power back to cruise and lean the mixture? Give me a freakin' break. I'll bet he didn't pay nearly as much attention to your fundamental flying skills, SA, head work, as he did the details that don't in anyway pertain to preparing your for the PTS.

Go fly off campus man. Find a local 141 school, and save yourself the cash and head ache. I did my MEI over a weekend with a buddy in 4 hours, Riddle wanted 5500 bucks and 15 hours of flight time. Your pilots licence doesn't say where you got it from.