ADR/DME Require approaches
03-10-2010, 10:34 PM
#1
Does NOT get weekends off
Thread Starter
Joined APC: Jul 2007
Position: ERJ - 145
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ADR/DME Require approaches
I know many approaches have the "ADF" or "DME" required addendum but GPS is allowed to substitute for it. However, let's say you did not have GPS. If you are being radar vectored for the approach, do you still need ADF or DME? I seem to recall an instructor once telling me that if you are being vectored for the approach you do not need it (like how GPS can be used as a substitute).
Also look at this approach http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/1002/00083IL21L.PDF
It says ADF required but it is also identified by the 8.5 DME. Could you shoot this approach if you did not have GPS but you did have DME?
Thanks.
Also look at this approach http://204.108.4.16/d-tpp/1002/00083IL21L.PDF
It says ADF required but it is also identified by the 8.5 DME. Could you shoot this approach if you did not have GPS but you did have DME?
Thanks.
03-11-2010, 04:08 AM
#2
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2008
Posts: 826
I'm not aware of any rule that allows substitution of radar for a required navaid in an approach prodecure in the absence of the note saying "...OR RADAR..."
If you look closely, you'll see that MADEIRA is an IAF and that ADF is required because it's how you get there from MOAKS intersection (which is why it's a planview note not just a chart note).
Go to the en route chart and locate MOAKS.
SkyVector.com - Aeronautical Charts - Flight Planning
How does 8.5 DME off the localizer get you directly from MOAKS to MADEIRA (other than by dead reckoning)? It doesn't. You need the waypoint.
If you look closely, you'll see that MADEIRA is an IAF and that ADF is required because it's how you get there from MOAKS intersection (which is why it's a planview note not just a chart note).
Go to the en route chart and locate MOAKS.
SkyVector.com - Aeronautical Charts - Flight Planning
How does 8.5 DME off the localizer get you directly from MOAKS to MADEIRA (other than by dead reckoning)? It doesn't. You need the waypoint.
03-11-2010, 10:58 AM
#3
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2007
Position: JS32 FO
Posts: 848
You can get vectors onto the approach and ID the LOM through DME. There's a whole paragraph on it in the AIM. But you CANNOT substitute anything for an approach to an alternate. So if this is your alternate, now you must have another approach you are equipped for or non-precision minimums or another alternate. But without vectoring, you cannot do this approach without RNAV or ADF.
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