TonyC

Did you forget the rest of your sentence, or did you fail to think of a comeback?






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RedeyeAV8r

Just remember the 2 initial TA's we turned down in 1995, 1996 were sweetened each time. We didn't even really have real UNION organization then. YMMV and past performance doesn't guarantee future returns. If this TA is voted down , not saying it will be, but if it is and the "Line Pilots" say we want it improved and mean it, it will get improved in my opinion. The company doesn't want open negotiations either. They want a Deal, just on their terms. Delta will settle their Pilots 2nd try, and UPS may get a contract soon, SWA might reject theirs or settle. Lots of variables, but if this TA doesn't get ratified, I am confident we will get it improved. Not saying it will be eye watering, not saying it will happen in a couple months, but my money is on it will happen.

Rock

iPhone switchology. I'm getting old.

TonyC

Yepp, that's exactly what I've been saying all along.

Good grief.





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Rock

If we vote it down, I certainly hope you're right. Currently Richard Anderson is on record as saying the next Delta contract will offer less than the TA they rejected. That statement has about the same value as "we deserve more", but at least publicly, Delta management did not take the rejection of their TA as some form of leverage that they want to resolve quickly. There is no word over there on when negotiations will even start again.
And if we have to negotiate a second TA that takes a year or more and isn't eye wateringly better than the current TA, we will have won the battle and lost the war. It will take something eye watering to make up for giving up the current proposed pay raise alone. 10% more than my current pay for a year is worth a heck of a lot more in the long run than $5k per year of signing bonus we got with this TA. And since it would be us delaying a new contract this time around, I doubt the company is going to be feeling really charitable about extra compensation for our vote to extend negotiations.
With all that said...I share your hope if we end up voting this TA down. Fast, eye watering resolution. Sounds pretty good.

Rock

Funny. That's exactly what I thought when I read your Uncle Remus dialogue about me. Maybe we should both try to keep our discussion above the tar baby level.

TonyC

This TA came before the amendable date of their current CBA. Even if they don't talk again before the amendable date, they will be required by the RLA to negotiate when the CBA becomes amendable if either party opens. It's not as if Delta can decide they don't want to ever talk again. They thought they could buy off their pilots on the cheap. They miscalculated.






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Rock

It is too early to say they miscalculated. We won't know for sure until the second TA is cut. Don't buy your captain's house until you're a captain, and don't start spending your new contract money until it's ratified. ...or start admiring another pilot group until they've won their war.

iarapilot

Rock, are you a lawyer? I ask because you seem to be able to rationalize any response that you present....almost.

TonyC

Other than the dialect, I can't imagine how you got Uncle Remus out of that. He told stories about animals, folktales, fables. He has nothing to do with your seeming willingness to bow down to the demands of The Company and accept the table scraps they're willing to part with. If playing the part of a plantation hand reminds you of a tar baby, I don't know how we can help you.


(If I had intended to compare you with Uncle Remus, that would have been a compliment. Don't flatter yourself.)






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