Buyer's remorse??
01-22-2023, 01:02 PM
#251
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: B767
Posts: 814
The fact that reserves are not being used and certainly rarely needed in one hour is further evidence as to why we should be working to improve the callout time to a more reasonable industry standard. Very few of our pilots are on reserve by choice and many are commuters. These commuters will sit in a crashpad for 15 to 19 days a month. No one is suggesting you are not obliged to fly if needed on your reserve days. This is a job and you should be available to fly on the days that you are being paid to be available to the company. That being said, data very likely shows a much longer callout with some short call availability provisions would not cause any stress to the operation and would greatly improve pilot QOL. I do not understand your inherent need to defend weak sections of the contract, however, that is certainly your prerogative if you so desire and you clearly do.
01-22-2023, 01:09 PM
#252
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2018
Posts: 1,838
The fact that reserves are not being used and certainly rarely needed in one hour is further evidence as to why we should be working to improve the callout time to a more reasonable industry standard. Very few of our pilots are on reserve by choice and many are commuters. These commuters will sit in a crashpad for 15 to 19 days a month. No one is suggesting you are not obliged to fly if needed on your reserve days. This is a job and you should be available to fly on the days that you are being paid to be available to the company. That being said, data very likely shows a much longer callout with some short call availability provisions would not cause any stress to the operation and would greatly improve pilot QOL. I do not understand your inherent need to defend weak sections of the contract, however, that is certainly your prerogative if you so desire and you clearly do.
Did you read my post? I said I WAS in favor of making small changes with reserve. The callout time would be a good one to tackle. I didn’t see anything in the openers though on that. I think some aren’t spending time to understand the contract and some of the tricks of the trade with reserve. Go into VIPS and look at the reserve bid line adjustment options. Staffing varies the usefulness of some options. That’s the case at every airline.
01-22-2023, 03:27 PM
#253
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2017
Posts: 2,140
Did you read my post? I said I WAS in favor of making small changes with reserve. The callout time would be a good one to tackle. I didn’t see anything in the openers though on that. I think some aren’t spending time to understand the contract and some of the tricks of the trade with reserve. Go into VIPS and look at the reserve bid line adjustment options. Staffing varies the usefulness of some options. That’s the case at every airline.
01-22-2023, 03:33 PM
#254
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2018
Posts: 1,838
01-22-2023, 03:56 PM
#255
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Nov 2017
Posts: 2,140
If you felt that big changes were needed (in any area), would you be against it for fear of creating other issues?
01-22-2023, 04:05 PM
#256
Banned
Joined APC: Jun 2018
Posts: 1,838
The areas that need changed in reserve don’t necessitate the need for a complete rewrite. Next round of negotiations if we decide to do complete rewrites, I’m not opposed to it. Many are though it appears from the posts.
01-22-2023, 08:08 PM
#257
New Hire
Joined APC: Jan 2023
Posts: 2
To the OP I very much understand your sentiments. I was junior at my legacy during the covid stupidity and bought into all of the hype and left my legacy to come to purple. My perspective is coming from being junior on a domestic only fleet but coming to Fed Ex is by far the worst career decision I've ever made. I've been at Fed Ex for a year and a half and it is by far the worst flying job I've ever had. What amazes me is that so many folks think that FedEx is the best job in the industry. I don't know if they came straight from a regional or the military, but having come from a legacy I'd say Fed Ex is the one of the worst jobs in the industry. This post is mainly directed to others who are either thinking of coming to Fed Ex or want to leave their legacy or Southwest job to come here, my recommendation is don't. The only reason to come to Purple is if you live in Memphis and then I'd highly question your judgement for choosing to live in Memphis. If you haven't been to Memphis, it's a special kind of hell.
The good things we have here are
1) Perceived stability, although that is debatable. Fed Ex is doing the worst out of all of the airlines right now and we are the only ones who are not hiring. BLGs in the 75, MD and bus went below 68 CH for Feb. I wouldn't be surprised if we see 4a2b this summer. Fed Ex has never furloughed, but past performance is no indication of future performance. With retirements at AA and UAL, I'd argue you're safer from furlough at either of those carriers.
2) If you don't like pax you don't have to deal with them. Quite honestly I never had an issue with pax. The job is the same up front and when I did have a pax issue it was the FAs or gate agents who dealt with it. I'd prefer flying pax to commuting into Memphis at midnight, trying to get a nap in the crappy sleep room and showing at 2:30 am.
3) More opportunities to fly widebodies and perhaps the ability to be a WB captain much earlier in your career. However, 76 captain at Delta just went very junior, so I'm not sure that's even a positive for Fed Ex anymore
4) The ability to deviate deadheads, but if the company keeps using low baseline fares, pilots will either dip into their bank or pay out of pocket if the have no bank.
The Negatives
1) Memphis. Whether you live here or not you will be here quite a bit. Memphis is the most disgusting and violent town I have ever been to and that includes the many third world and war torn countries I've been to. Anyone who lives in Memphis should be absolutely ashamed for letting their town become so violent and disgusting. In fact, Jetflyers today had a bunch of pilots complaining about their cars being broken into in the employee parking lot!! The company does not care about the safety of their pilots. In fact, someone pointed out there are no cameras in the employee parking lot and security is doing nothing about it. I hear stories of how every year Fed Ex pilots are robbed or car jacked in Memphis. I even heard a story where a Fed Ex pilot was killed in a road rage incident in Memphis. Yes, it really is that bad.
2) We have high pay rates but a 68 Credit Hour BLG. Yes, as a widebody FO you will make more per hour, but a narrowbody FO at a legacy will make as much or more than you because they get more credit hours. Typical lines at legacy airlines are 80 CH and min guarantee is 73-76 CH depending on the airlines.
3) Because of our pay structure you will work more days for less credit. On the domestic side I typically work 15 days to credit in the low 70's. My friends at the legacy airlines work 13-14 days for 85 CH. Yes, we block less hours at Fed Ex, but any day I'm gone from home is considered work whether I'm flying or not!
4) I believe Fed Ex has a toxic culture. I feel more like a number here than I ever did at my legacy. I've flown with more A-Hole Captains here than I ever did at my legacy. I once got debriefed because I asked the Captain if he wanted water and he debriefed me that I should have never asked that question and it should always be assumed.
5) At my legacy probation was just a word. However, at Fed Ex they like to hold it over our heads and remind us that our job is always on the line as probies.
6) Our system bid is by far the worst in the industry. If you don't like what you got during indoc, too bad because the next system bid may not be for 1 year, 2 year, 3 years, who knows. It all depends on when management feels like they should have another bid. If you're in a widebody seat lock when the next bid comes out, too bad because you'll have to wait another few years until the next bid. Even once you bid out of your equipment it may take years until you're actually given your award, meanwhile new hires are being trained in front of you.
7) Our retirement plan. I'd say this is neutral. We have an A Plan and a B Plan. Given my age, I'd prefer 16% DC and cash over cap versus our current plan but this all comes down to where you are in life and what you have in your nest egg.
8) As a new hire at Fed Ex you will be expected to get a crashpad on your own dime during training after indoc. You will not be receiving any per diem and you will be making a whopping $4000 per month until you are activated after your IOE. Fed Ex is the only airline that still does this. That alone should have told me this was not a good place to be. At my previous legacy I was given 85 CH per month, lodging and transportation provided and per diem.
9) Our work rules are absolutely atrocious and arguably some of the worst in the industry. Crew scheduling is able to change your sequence at will and call it a revision. I've had double deadheads revised into hub turns. How our contract allows them to do this blows my mind. You may get paid overages but you'll have to insite them and that will take months and it's up to the company if they want to pay you or not. Substitution is another horrible horrible rule. At any other airline you'll get paid and get to go home if your trip cancels due to company decisions. But at Fed Ex we get the pleasure of either accepting substitution and being on the hook or making it up sometime in the future at 125% and that's if I can find open time which in this current environment is not likely.
10) Our Reserve rules are the worst in the industry. We have RA, RB and R24. If you're on RA or RB you'll more than likely get assigned airport standby. If you're on R24 you'll get assigned hotel standby in Memphis on your first day.
11) Commuting here is also more difficult than I was told it would be. I lived in base at my legacy and came to Fed Ex because I was told it was easy to commute. It's not as easy as you think. There are a lot of domestic trips that start on Sunday afternoon and Monday morning. In most towns there are no jumpseats on Fed Ex iron that leave after Saturday morning. So that means if I am awarded a trip or reserve that starts on Sunday afternoon or Monday morning, I have to either commute out on Saturday morning or roll the dice and try to offline jumpseat on Sunday or Monday. Also, many popular towns are serviced by the 75 and 76 which only have 3 jumpseats and an additional one that is captain blocked, meaning you have to either email or text the captain and ask them to release it and it's solely at captain discretion. If you live in a popular town like Tampa, Dallas or San Antonio I'd do some research and see if those towns are even commutable since the jumpseat can be so competititve.
12) The company will try to rip you off. You have to claim expenses for travel and non-contract hotels via a monthly expense report. The process takes the company months to get back to you and if you had an out of pocket expense, you will be out that money for several months. Also, the company at their discretion can and will deny expenses due to administrative reasons like receipt difficult to read or turning in the report late. As I mentioned above, if you are owed overages for a trip that changed, you will have to manually request them via a process called insite. Again, turn around time is slow and the company will do whatever they can to not pay you. Any company that tries to rip off its employees and not reimburse their employees what they are entitled to should tell you all you need to know about that company.
13) Junior schedules are horrible. I was under the impression that Fed Ex pilots on the domestic side worked week on week off and International pilots worked 2 weeks on and 2 weeks off. As a junior pilot on a domestic fleet you will have a shotgun schedule meaning you could work one day on, one day off and then have a 3 day followed by 2 days off, etc etc. This type of schedule is extremely difficult for commuters. Also, it's not uncommon for them to have a daytime sequence followed by night hub turns followed by day again, which is really difficult on your circadian rhythm and arguably unsafe. The bidpacks are continually getting worse and worse every month.
14) We have poor hotel language in our contract. On the domestic side I've stayed at some real dumps which in my opinion is unacceptable for the profession we're in.
I left my legacy to come to Fed Ex on the false perception that Fed Ex was the best place to be. In my opinion nothing could be further from the truth. For some reason we have a pilot group that thinks this is the best place in the world and I don't know if they're trying to make themselves feel better and convince themselves they made the right decision over their peer pax carriers or if they're just oblivious to how bad it is here. For a pilot group that kept the world alive during covid, I'm disappointed that they don't demand more from their employer. The stuff I've seen since being here is absolutely unacceptable. If you're thinking of coming to Fed Ex, I hope I did my best to highlight the things I wish I knew before coming here.
Having come from a legacy you will not make more money at Fed Ex, you will not have a better quality of life, you WILL work more, but hey at least there's free popcorn in the AOC.
I'm currently working on my apps to go back to a legacy. I hate having to start over again and it sickens me to think how much seniority I lost by leaving my previous legacy. I don't know if I'm jaded because I'm junior on a domestic only fleet. I can't decide if I should wait until I can bid over to something that does international and maybe things will get better or quit wasting potential seniority at a legacy and jump ship while I can. I keep hearing from captains that they had to spend years sitting sideways on the 72 before they could even go to the right seat and I get it, but the airlines are currently in an unprecedented hiring wave and why anyone would bother coming here is beyond me.
The good things we have here are
1) Perceived stability, although that is debatable. Fed Ex is doing the worst out of all of the airlines right now and we are the only ones who are not hiring. BLGs in the 75, MD and bus went below 68 CH for Feb. I wouldn't be surprised if we see 4a2b this summer. Fed Ex has never furloughed, but past performance is no indication of future performance. With retirements at AA and UAL, I'd argue you're safer from furlough at either of those carriers.
2) If you don't like pax you don't have to deal with them. Quite honestly I never had an issue with pax. The job is the same up front and when I did have a pax issue it was the FAs or gate agents who dealt with it. I'd prefer flying pax to commuting into Memphis at midnight, trying to get a nap in the crappy sleep room and showing at 2:30 am.
3) More opportunities to fly widebodies and perhaps the ability to be a WB captain much earlier in your career. However, 76 captain at Delta just went very junior, so I'm not sure that's even a positive for Fed Ex anymore
4) The ability to deviate deadheads, but if the company keeps using low baseline fares, pilots will either dip into their bank or pay out of pocket if the have no bank.
The Negatives
1) Memphis. Whether you live here or not you will be here quite a bit. Memphis is the most disgusting and violent town I have ever been to and that includes the many third world and war torn countries I've been to. Anyone who lives in Memphis should be absolutely ashamed for letting their town become so violent and disgusting. In fact, Jetflyers today had a bunch of pilots complaining about their cars being broken into in the employee parking lot!! The company does not care about the safety of their pilots. In fact, someone pointed out there are no cameras in the employee parking lot and security is doing nothing about it. I hear stories of how every year Fed Ex pilots are robbed or car jacked in Memphis. I even heard a story where a Fed Ex pilot was killed in a road rage incident in Memphis. Yes, it really is that bad.
2) We have high pay rates but a 68 Credit Hour BLG. Yes, as a widebody FO you will make more per hour, but a narrowbody FO at a legacy will make as much or more than you because they get more credit hours. Typical lines at legacy airlines are 80 CH and min guarantee is 73-76 CH depending on the airlines.
3) Because of our pay structure you will work more days for less credit. On the domestic side I typically work 15 days to credit in the low 70's. My friends at the legacy airlines work 13-14 days for 85 CH. Yes, we block less hours at Fed Ex, but any day I'm gone from home is considered work whether I'm flying or not!
4) I believe Fed Ex has a toxic culture. I feel more like a number here than I ever did at my legacy. I've flown with more A-Hole Captains here than I ever did at my legacy. I once got debriefed because I asked the Captain if he wanted water and he debriefed me that I should have never asked that question and it should always be assumed.
5) At my legacy probation was just a word. However, at Fed Ex they like to hold it over our heads and remind us that our job is always on the line as probies.
6) Our system bid is by far the worst in the industry. If you don't like what you got during indoc, too bad because the next system bid may not be for 1 year, 2 year, 3 years, who knows. It all depends on when management feels like they should have another bid. If you're in a widebody seat lock when the next bid comes out, too bad because you'll have to wait another few years until the next bid. Even once you bid out of your equipment it may take years until you're actually given your award, meanwhile new hires are being trained in front of you.
7) Our retirement plan. I'd say this is neutral. We have an A Plan and a B Plan. Given my age, I'd prefer 16% DC and cash over cap versus our current plan but this all comes down to where you are in life and what you have in your nest egg.
8) As a new hire at Fed Ex you will be expected to get a crashpad on your own dime during training after indoc. You will not be receiving any per diem and you will be making a whopping $4000 per month until you are activated after your IOE. Fed Ex is the only airline that still does this. That alone should have told me this was not a good place to be. At my previous legacy I was given 85 CH per month, lodging and transportation provided and per diem.
9) Our work rules are absolutely atrocious and arguably some of the worst in the industry. Crew scheduling is able to change your sequence at will and call it a revision. I've had double deadheads revised into hub turns. How our contract allows them to do this blows my mind. You may get paid overages but you'll have to insite them and that will take months and it's up to the company if they want to pay you or not. Substitution is another horrible horrible rule. At any other airline you'll get paid and get to go home if your trip cancels due to company decisions. But at Fed Ex we get the pleasure of either accepting substitution and being on the hook or making it up sometime in the future at 125% and that's if I can find open time which in this current environment is not likely.
10) Our Reserve rules are the worst in the industry. We have RA, RB and R24. If you're on RA or RB you'll more than likely get assigned airport standby. If you're on R24 you'll get assigned hotel standby in Memphis on your first day.
11) Commuting here is also more difficult than I was told it would be. I lived in base at my legacy and came to Fed Ex because I was told it was easy to commute. It's not as easy as you think. There are a lot of domestic trips that start on Sunday afternoon and Monday morning. In most towns there are no jumpseats on Fed Ex iron that leave after Saturday morning. So that means if I am awarded a trip or reserve that starts on Sunday afternoon or Monday morning, I have to either commute out on Saturday morning or roll the dice and try to offline jumpseat on Sunday or Monday. Also, many popular towns are serviced by the 75 and 76 which only have 3 jumpseats and an additional one that is captain blocked, meaning you have to either email or text the captain and ask them to release it and it's solely at captain discretion. If you live in a popular town like Tampa, Dallas or San Antonio I'd do some research and see if those towns are even commutable since the jumpseat can be so competititve.
12) The company will try to rip you off. You have to claim expenses for travel and non-contract hotels via a monthly expense report. The process takes the company months to get back to you and if you had an out of pocket expense, you will be out that money for several months. Also, the company at their discretion can and will deny expenses due to administrative reasons like receipt difficult to read or turning in the report late. As I mentioned above, if you are owed overages for a trip that changed, you will have to manually request them via a process called insite. Again, turn around time is slow and the company will do whatever they can to not pay you. Any company that tries to rip off its employees and not reimburse their employees what they are entitled to should tell you all you need to know about that company.
13) Junior schedules are horrible. I was under the impression that Fed Ex pilots on the domestic side worked week on week off and International pilots worked 2 weeks on and 2 weeks off. As a junior pilot on a domestic fleet you will have a shotgun schedule meaning you could work one day on, one day off and then have a 3 day followed by 2 days off, etc etc. This type of schedule is extremely difficult for commuters. Also, it's not uncommon for them to have a daytime sequence followed by night hub turns followed by day again, which is really difficult on your circadian rhythm and arguably unsafe. The bidpacks are continually getting worse and worse every month.
14) We have poor hotel language in our contract. On the domestic side I've stayed at some real dumps which in my opinion is unacceptable for the profession we're in.
I left my legacy to come to Fed Ex on the false perception that Fed Ex was the best place to be. In my opinion nothing could be further from the truth. For some reason we have a pilot group that thinks this is the best place in the world and I don't know if they're trying to make themselves feel better and convince themselves they made the right decision over their peer pax carriers or if they're just oblivious to how bad it is here. For a pilot group that kept the world alive during covid, I'm disappointed that they don't demand more from their employer. The stuff I've seen since being here is absolutely unacceptable. If you're thinking of coming to Fed Ex, I hope I did my best to highlight the things I wish I knew before coming here.
Having come from a legacy you will not make more money at Fed Ex, you will not have a better quality of life, you WILL work more, but hey at least there's free popcorn in the AOC.
I'm currently working on my apps to go back to a legacy. I hate having to start over again and it sickens me to think how much seniority I lost by leaving my previous legacy. I don't know if I'm jaded because I'm junior on a domestic only fleet. I can't decide if I should wait until I can bid over to something that does international and maybe things will get better or quit wasting potential seniority at a legacy and jump ship while I can. I keep hearing from captains that they had to spend years sitting sideways on the 72 before they could even go to the right seat and I get it, but the airlines are currently in an unprecedented hiring wave and why anyone would bother coming here is beyond me.
01-23-2023, 07:00 AM
#258
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Dec 2018
Posts: 248
How about duty limits more restrictive than FARs and back in base by noon on last day of RA...things even the regionals have. It's absolutely ridiculous we can start reserve at midnight and be expected to go 16 hours.
Also, reserves get hosed with our non punitive fatigue policy. If you're on RB and fly in from the west coast and land around 11 Memphis time and are given "legal rest" to fly the Sunday morning "RB" trip that shows at 0030 (completely flipping your sleep schedule, you just woke up 6 hrs ago), if you call in fatigued you now have a red block over your schedule for the footprint of that trip, the reserve hours are dropped, and you have to make them up. Meanwhile there could be plenty of other RB trips during that footprint you could easily operate, but now you've lost that pay and if you have additional reserve days after the footprint you might not be able to commute home...how exactly is that non punitive?
Also, reserves get hosed with our non punitive fatigue policy. If you're on RB and fly in from the west coast and land around 11 Memphis time and are given "legal rest" to fly the Sunday morning "RB" trip that shows at 0030 (completely flipping your sleep schedule, you just woke up 6 hrs ago), if you call in fatigued you now have a red block over your schedule for the footprint of that trip, the reserve hours are dropped, and you have to make them up. Meanwhile there could be plenty of other RB trips during that footprint you could easily operate, but now you've lost that pay and if you have additional reserve days after the footprint you might not be able to commute home...how exactly is that non punitive?
01-23-2023, 07:13 AM
#259
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: B767
Posts: 814
Many are in favor of work rule improvements to industry standard during this round of negotiations. Many intend to vote NO if they don’t see these improvements.
01-23-2023, 07:51 AM
#260
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jun 2017
Posts: 41
Before anyone jumps on you I want to say thank you for posting what you did. You put into words so many things I have noticed, but then wondered if maybe it's not just me that doesn't get it. I'm dissatisfied with this job and that's a first in what is becoming a pretty long career at this point. Every job has had it's pluses and minuses, but this is the first time I have actually been just unhappy at a flying job. I am considering re-arranging my life to enable a pay cut, but for now just thinking about it. But it is something I am thinking about more and more.
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