Originally Posted by NotMrNiceGuy

What is it with people wanting to see the contract from a unique position that benefits only themselves? The contract represents the entire group.

25.H.2.g
The pilot is removed from the trip because he will or is projected to exceed FAR limitations or because of other government controlled restrictions.

If the Company wants to negotiate some kind of Vaccination LOA or MOU that supersedes the current substitution language like literally every other major carrier has negotiated, then do it. ALPA will speak for me.

Until then, we’ll just abide by the current language and the Union/Company can hash it out. If individuals would like disclose their medical status free of charge, it’s a free country. Go for it. But you’re doing that in a personal capacity and outside of the union and contract language. Ultimately, you’re negotiating for yourself, instead of the group; as evidenced by your willingness to have your brethren removed without pay despite the words of the CBA. IMO, it cheapens us as a group. But that is for the individual to decide.

Originally Posted by Dakota

As far as can tell from the CIQ pages, I don't see the vaccination verification a big deal...................yet.

• Stay away from South Africa if you can. That seems to create problems for several countries.
• Vax is required in Brazil and Columbia. Not a big deal to most of us with only one family..................in the United States😆 I haven't noticed any South America lines in the 777 bidpack.
• Italy is a possible LIMFAC in Europe since they require tests if not vaccinated. Watch out for the 9 month window for vax vs. un-vaxed. More of an A$$ pain than anything else.
• I didn't see any vaccine requirements in Asia

I just don't see a lot, if any, revisions due to vax vs. un-vaxed.

What am I missing?

Originally Posted by pinseeker

Just think about your medical certificate. If you don't get it before it expires, does the company put you in SUB or NOQ without pay?

Originally Posted by Overnitefr8

I have a question for the unvaxxed. Ethically, not contractually, when should you inform the company before a trip that you know you can't fly it because the country requires a vaccination? I'm vaxxed because my dad and wife's parents are very vulnerable and we visit them a lot. I would feel very bad if I gave anyone covid, especially very elderly. I have no problem with those who aren't vaxxed as long you're responsible about. I'm not sure what the solution is regarding being removed from trips because you're not vaxxed when it's required. I just don't want my trips revised to go places because someone isn't vaxxed.

Originally Posted by magic rat

Two things to take note of:

1) Ethically I don’t have to tell them anything, they put that out already, a non reply will be considered as unvaxxed status. There you go.

2) Uhhh, but the vaccinated aren’t protected against getting the virus also, they are fully capable and are spreading it just as easily as the unvaxxed. All the “vaccine” does is hopefully prevent severe symptoms. So, you’re fooling yourself if you keep thinking that you can’t get it and can’t spread it to other people.

Originally Posted by magic rat

Two things to take note of:

1) Ethically I don’t have to tell them anything, they put that out already, a non reply will be considered as unvaxxed status. There you go.
.

Originally Posted by BertMacklinFBI

#2 is the thing that confuses me the absolute most about all these imposed restrictions. While I think it’s safe to say the vaccine does offer SOME protection from getting the virus. It certainly doesn’t stop it. I sympathize with both sides. But the restrictions really don’t make much sense. Even testing before entry. Sure it gives someone a warm and fuzzy and may stop a few people with Covid from getting into a country. But, you can have it. Test negative even with symptoms. Then several days later test positive. It’s all some hocus pocus “preventative” measures that makes someone feel safe, somewhere. And if I’m not mistaken the vaccine does a pretty good job of preventing serious infection/death. Majority of deaths and hospitalizations are from unvaccinated. I didn’t say all. So calm down.