What's the Latest at ASA/Expressjet?
08-26-2014, 12:13 PM
#7061
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,951
You want to have an argument face to face with somebody? The whole point of the threads it allow someone to vent and gain another’s perspective without compromising their professional integrity. Do you think your Qol would go up if these conversations took place in the cockpit on every 4 day, or do you just think you’re a man and would put everyone else in their place?
08-26-2014, 12:18 PM
#7062
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2010
Posts: 1,951
LOL you should've added that pic of you from Facebook to go along with your recycled post! And you and your buddy John are widely known industry wide for being all over the internet spewing the same baseless rhetoric; thankfully I've never had the occasion to meet you in person.
08-26-2014, 12:21 PM
#7063
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 484
Not in a union. And really... I don't wish harm on others, but when Nevets does nothing but come on here and spew hate and vitriol just to drive the wedge deeper between L-XJT and L-ASA/SKW then yes, I do wish she would just go away.
08-26-2014, 12:32 PM
#7064
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: May 2010
Posts: 205
To be fair, what Nevets does on here, is the exact same thing John does on Facebook.
08-26-2014, 02:51 PM
#7066
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2014
Posts: 118
You're right. Let's get back to the topic at hand. Tell us more about the SKW BOD running out of patience, because they certainly didn't sound that way on the earnings call.
08-26-2014, 02:55 PM
#7067
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2007
Position: EMB 145 CPT
Posts: 2,934
Nevets and others try to blame all of this on some grand conspiracy of SkyWest Inc. to purposely make XJT unprofitable. That simply isn't true.
The fact is, LXJT pilots are living in a bubble from the past. They think this is still the world when they were CAL's exclusive feed and had a 10 percent cost plus CPA as the exclusive feed. In addition, CAL Exp. and later XJT, never experienced the whipsaw that Delta and United have been using for decades. The DCI and United Express battlefield are littered with corpses of dead regionals or regionals that rebranded after Delta and United got done with them. WestAir, AirWisc, Comair, ACA, etc.
These aren't "little trivial" differences. There is a huge cultural difference between the two carriers. There are huge differences in expectations. And then there is the very real difference pertaining to scheduling methods.
After four years, not only haven't those differences been narrowed, they have actually grown. It is time to move on. As Nevets says, everyone needs a plan B. The ASA side is executing their plan B. That is protecting the interests of their pilots.
The fact is, LXJT pilots are living in a bubble from the past. They think this is still the world when they were CAL's exclusive feed and had a 10 percent cost plus CPA as the exclusive feed. In addition, CAL Exp. and later XJT, never experienced the whipsaw that Delta and United have been using for decades. The DCI and United Express battlefield are littered with corpses of dead regionals or regionals that rebranded after Delta and United got done with them. WestAir, AirWisc, Comair, ACA, etc.
These aren't "little trivial" differences. There is a huge cultural difference between the two carriers. There are huge differences in expectations. And then there is the very real difference pertaining to scheduling methods.
After four years, not only haven't those differences been narrowed, they have actually grown. It is time to move on. As Nevets says, everyone needs a plan B. The ASA side is executing their plan B. That is protecting the interests of their pilots.
Look, management told us before the vote, with no new contract, no new aircraft and we are stuck with a static fleet plan in the mean time. And yet we still all voted no overwhelmingly. So it doesn't matter about past
CPAs. We all said we don't want concessions, regardless. So we continue with our current contracts and they draw down the fleet. So what's the big deal?
Anyway, each MEC has been acting in their pilots' best interest. Its only one MEC who complains about the other doing that.
Nevets - I haven't read any of your posts, but I noticed you seemed like the one XJT'er that kept this ridiculous thread going in its current direction. If what bedrock wrote is a summery of your posts then I owe you an apology. This summery is correct information. Please don't feed these trolls anymore. Youre not going to change anyone's mind on here.
The bubble you are living in is thinking that regional CPAs can pay what they did in their heyday when mainline carriers couldn't get their hands on enough RJ flying and paid top dollar for those CPAs. In addition, CalExp/XJT had the added benefit of being the exclusive feed for CAL. Both of those days are long gone. Instead of being a shortage of RJ feed and an exclusive operator, there is now a surplus of RJ feed and you are one of many subcontractors vying for that shrinking business.
The real amazing part is how many of you can't see that and still think this is the same FFD business as it was 15 years ago.
The real amazing part is how many of you can't see that and still think this is the same FFD business as it was 15 years ago.
And let's not forget these industry outliers, which are the true reason XE is losing money:
Industry leading 50 seat RJ rates
Company paid defined contribution retirement plans
90% company paid PPO health insurance
Company paid On the Job Injury (OJI) bank
Line Bidding with vacation touch/drop
Inability of the company to contact on-duty crew members for rescheduling except in person
No operational flexibility
Angry labor groups, unwilling to perform above minimum requirements of contracts.
This is not a union vs union pi$$ing contest. This is a very real merger failure because of diametrically opposed cultures clashing in a vacuum of leadership.
So yes, it's time for the ACQUIRED (not hired) carrier to get on board or get parked. The SKW BOD has clearly run out of patience. They are not going to let the angry money losing side sink the profitable and willing side.
Industry leading 50 seat RJ rates
Company paid defined contribution retirement plans
90% company paid PPO health insurance
Company paid On the Job Injury (OJI) bank
Line Bidding with vacation touch/drop
Inability of the company to contact on-duty crew members for rescheduling except in person
No operational flexibility
Angry labor groups, unwilling to perform above minimum requirements of contracts.
This is not a union vs union pi$$ing contest. This is a very real merger failure because of diametrically opposed cultures clashing in a vacuum of leadership.
So yes, it's time for the ACQUIRED (not hired) carrier to get on board or get parked. The SKW BOD has clearly run out of patience. They are not going to let the angry money losing side sink the profitable and willing side.
They no longer want you to work for less. They are just going to have you not work or get paid any longer. Kills two birds with one stone.
If the draw down of aircraft is equal to attrition, then everyone is happy. If the draw down forces furloughs you can always go to Mesa, and making even less than what the company originally offered.
If the draw down of aircraft is equal to attrition, then everyone is happy. If the draw down forces furloughs you can always go to Mesa, and making even less than what the company originally offered.
By the way, CC also said on the earnings call that they are working on a schedule to park aircraft so as to no have to furlough. We will see. I think they will have to park aircraft faster than that.
I still don't understand this battle between MECs I'm on LXJT side and I would be alright trying a beta of smart pref and flight line side by side and see their results at the end of a bid. Obviously allow LASA pilots to do the same. Definitely allow the pilots to make the choice not our MECs. FL or smartpref does not matter not like our hard lines have been worth a crap anyway. Might as well allow us to get a glimpse of both no? Time to lift these walls and get moving to building a better QOL for all of us I think.
Well I've attended the meetings and talked to people in the know and the stuff on here is....well crap. LXJT is getting PBS and some of the outliers will be gone with the new contract. That's a fact. The hold up is the SmartPref/Flightline battle. I'm not going to point fingers because I think it will get worked out.
As I said earlier, I've only ever encountered one ASA guy I didn't care for. The stuff I see here is a few extremists arguing. The vast majority of us want a deal done and that will happen. I will say though that when ASA was looking at potential furloughs a year or so ago nobody over here seemed happy about it...you guys on here wanting LXJT to fade a away (along with over 1,000 pilots hired post merger) are reflecting poorly on your pilot group.
If I were to guess, the ASA side wants Flightline locked in now because if it isn't then it could eventually come down to a pilot group vote...which would probably swing in LXJTs favor. Since we are losing airplanes, there is perceived leverage.
We should all remember that we will eventually be flying together and act accordingly.
As I said earlier, I've only ever encountered one ASA guy I didn't care for. The stuff I see here is a few extremists arguing. The vast majority of us want a deal done and that will happen. I will say though that when ASA was looking at potential furloughs a year or so ago nobody over here seemed happy about it...you guys on here wanting LXJT to fade a away (along with over 1,000 pilots hired post merger) are reflecting poorly on your pilot group.
If I were to guess, the ASA side wants Flightline locked in now because if it isn't then it could eventually come down to a pilot group vote...which would probably swing in LXJTs favor. Since we are losing airplanes, there is perceived leverage.
We should all remember that we will eventually be flying together and act accordingly.
As for PBS, the XJT MEC offered to weigh the vote equally in order to decide which PBS survives after a pilot vote.
But seriously, I don't go anywhere telling people to get on board or that we bought you, or that you should take concessions. Thats what some of these ASA guys do to us on here and on FB. I fight for our contract! I want them to have our contract! I fight against concessions of any kind! They don't reciprocate. And somehow I'm the bad guy?
08-26-2014, 03:51 PM
#7068
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2007
Posts: 1,023
08-26-2014, 04:53 PM
#7069
Line Holder
Joined APC: Oct 2013
Posts: 77
Yes, I'm new here, so forgive me if I'm asking a question that's been covered in the past.
If we park a bunch of ERJs, who's gonna provide the lift for UAL, and with which airframe? Seems like the E175/E190 isn't gonna roll off the line as fast as we park planes. And I doubt (call me naive) that our union is just gonna let someone else start flying our planes without protecting our pilots.
So it seems to me that it's highly likely that we come down to the last minute and all the sudden UAL and INC come to a new agreement on price that makes sense for both to preserve the lift. I doubt that UAL is just gonna let all those folks look for another way to get where they're going.
On the other hand, Delta has 88 AirTran 717s that they seem to be testing out as a regional feeder. Seems like they are gonna try to send twice the seats half as often and see how that works out. I don't have any idea if it's gonna work for them, I'm not sure if they do either. But it's a plan.
What is the plan for UAL?
If we park a bunch of ERJs, who's gonna provide the lift for UAL, and with which airframe? Seems like the E175/E190 isn't gonna roll off the line as fast as we park planes. And I doubt (call me naive) that our union is just gonna let someone else start flying our planes without protecting our pilots.
So it seems to me that it's highly likely that we come down to the last minute and all the sudden UAL and INC come to a new agreement on price that makes sense for both to preserve the lift. I doubt that UAL is just gonna let all those folks look for another way to get where they're going.
On the other hand, Delta has 88 AirTran 717s that they seem to be testing out as a regional feeder. Seems like they are gonna try to send twice the seats half as often and see how that works out. I don't have any idea if it's gonna work for them, I'm not sure if they do either. But it's a plan.
What is the plan for UAL?
08-26-2014, 05:45 PM
#7070
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 484
Yes, I'm new here, so forgive me if I'm asking a question that's been covered in the past.
If we park a bunch of ERJs, who's gonna provide the lift for UAL, and with which airframe? Seems like the E175/E190 isn't gonna roll off the line as fast as we park planes. And I doubt (call me naive) that our union is just gonna let someone else start flying our planes without protecting our pilots.
So it seems to me that it's highly likely that we come down to the last minute and all the sudden UAL and INC come to a new agreement on price that makes sense for both to preserve the lift. I doubt that UAL is just gonna let all those folks look for another way to get where they're going.
On the other hand, Delta has 88 AirTran 717s that they seem to be testing out as a regional feeder. Seems like they are gonna try to send twice the seats half as often and see how that works out. I don't have any idea if it's gonna work for them, I'm not sure if they do either. But it's a plan.
What is the plan for UAL?
If we park a bunch of ERJs, who's gonna provide the lift for UAL, and with which airframe? Seems like the E175/E190 isn't gonna roll off the line as fast as we park planes. And I doubt (call me naive) that our union is just gonna let someone else start flying our planes without protecting our pilots.
So it seems to me that it's highly likely that we come down to the last minute and all the sudden UAL and INC come to a new agreement on price that makes sense for both to preserve the lift. I doubt that UAL is just gonna let all those folks look for another way to get where they're going.
On the other hand, Delta has 88 AirTran 717s that they seem to be testing out as a regional feeder. Seems like they are gonna try to send twice the seats half as often and see how that works out. I don't have any idea if it's gonna work for them, I'm not sure if they do either. But it's a plan.
What is the plan for UAL?
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