Originally Posted by Captain Tony

Why do you think "ASA has their backs to the wall"? i work here and I don't see it that way at all.

Originally Posted by freezingflyboy

I thought I said company shenanigans aside... I consider globalization to be shenanigans. That said, with the exception of last December when they screwed the pooch on the SmartPref awards, what I see just before the bid closes is what I've been awarded. Not saying that will ALWAYS be the case, just been my experience. YMMV.

Originally Posted by RgrMurdock

I thought the system ran every 6 minutes or so. I thought what you see is what you get in regards to bidding as long as others above you don't change their bids.

Originally Posted by Waitingformins

Originally Posted by freezingflyboy

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Originally Posted by RgrMurdock


I know I'm thread drifting a bit here. I asked a question previously about smart pref which is the PBS system being entertained by expressjet. Anyone that has any experience with this... does the real time bidding give an incentive for people to try to change / modify their bids at the last minute? Or are people generally happy with what they see? I know this is a small percentage of pilots because you currently utilize the program for build up / composite line holders.




For the record, relief/composite/buildup lines as well as all reserve lines are currently being built with SmartPref. So currently 20-25% of L-XJT pilots are using SmartPref.

Originally Posted by RgrMurdock

I hear everything you're saying. I'm just trying to play devil's advocate here. If you did bid early, and then you receive 5-10 emails that your bid just changed, wouldn't that give you incentive to go and try to fine tune your bid to make it look like you wanted when the instant bid award came out? Times that by 100's of people and things can get pretty crazy. Again, I'm just trying to play devil's advocate and assume the worst case scenario. Has this system not been implemented just because of the craziness of the merger? Is it because of the vacation bid low on the ASA side? Even if it is because of the ASA side not wanting it, I thought this system was in place well before the merger but possibly was not considered to go live with the whole expressjet side? Why was that? I'm not trying to argue for one side or the other. I'm just trying to gather the facts here.

Originally Posted by Captain Tony

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Originally Posted by flyguy94


LXJT is going to cease to exist in June? I will report back in June and let you know how it's going. Your rumors are false and your generalization of LXJT is ridiculous



We have received some questions from pilots that indicate there is misinformation in circulation about the content and results of the meeting on Wednesday. The facts of the meeting are as follows:



· ALPA presented the Company with selected information from the polling data regarding pilot perceptions of the condition of the Company, pilot opinions of management, and general expectations for a new JCBA.

· The parties discussed shortcomings of previous communications efforts and how each side intends to better explain the process and the outcome to pilots.

· The parties discussed current operational problems and contract compliance issues. The Company acknowledged that the pilots need to see results in these areas and is working to make that a reality.

· ALPA clearly stated that concessions of any kind in the JCBA are not acceptable.

· The Company acknowledged that improvements must be made to the failed agreement; a reorganization of the failed JCBA’s overall value would not work.

· The Company asked to begin negotiations as soon as possible.

· The parties committed to continue the negotiations process without delay.

· The parties mutually agreed on the June dates for exchange of full proposals..

While a waiting until June to continue is not ideal, several important factors contributed to this decision:

· Developing an opening proposal is a complex and important task. Openers set the tone for a negotiating process, and just like a first impression you only get one chance. Because we will be developing new proposals and not just rehashing the terms of the failed JCBA, this will take more time.

· The online survey of the pilot group is still in progress, and proposals cannot be developed until analysis of the survey is complete. If you have yet to do so, please take the survey now.

· The two MECs have yet to meet together to discuss specific JNC guidance for negotiations and to determine a single position on new JCBA issues. We will not present openers to the Company until our positions have been vetted and approved by both MECs.

· There is currently a recall vote in Council 176, and the XJT MEC strongly believes that a decision on openers must be delayed until that process is complete so the pilots of 176 are properly represented.




What part of this disputes that your reps refused to meet until June?

I was at that meeting. Yeah. Your reps giggled, texted each other, surfed the internet, and generally refused to engage. Wood did all the talking . CG and DA fooled around like high schoolers in the back of the room in social studies. Then suddenly when the mediator and company asked for meetings the first and last week of May, they insisted they had to wait until the recalls were over because they had no authorization. CG started in with his "no one wants a merger" crap that he spouted off the first time we met the mediator in April. Then Wood had the June meeting moved to BOS because he has personal issues to attend to then and that's where he lives.

That spin and propaganda your side put out may save face with you guys, but it isn't the whole truth. The truth is that your side is about to screw us all.

When someone throws a bag of money on the table, you take it. You don't say maybe I'll form a committee to determine a future date when we might be willing to talk about taking it.

Originally Posted by Bozo

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Originally Posted by freezingflyboy


For the record, relief/composite/buildup lines as well as all reserve lines are currently being built with SmartPref. So currently 20-25% of L-XJT pilots are using SmartPref.

The only incentive I can deduce for bidding late is for the guys that just want to be a dikc. If your seniority will hold it, it can hold it, whether you bid the minute after SmartPref opens or the minute before it closes. There's no gamesmanship to be had, near as I can tell. Now, if you're the kind of guy that gets a hard-on from blowing up other people's bids at the last minute...well then...maybe you need to evaluate what's going on in your life and your mind that makes you want to act that way.

When I weigh the pros and cons, I keep trying to relate SmartPref to line bidding and traditional PBS bidding. With line bidding, it doesn't matter when you or people senior to you bid because if your seniority will hold it, it will hold it. Same with SmartPref. Difference is sometimes with line bidding you get surprised if people senior to you "bid down" or forget to bid. No surprises with SmartPref as it's a "live bidding environment" (company shenanigans aside). The advantage with SmartPref is that if someone senior to you does come in and blow up your entire bid, you will see it and have the opportunity to tweak your bid and hopefully salvage something that will work for you. Not so with traditional PBS, or even normal line bidding, when you think about it.




But what you see is not a final. The globalization does not activate until after the bid closes so you really are not seeing what you would get.

Originally Posted by Waitingformins

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Originally Posted by Captain Tony


Yes, you go to the bottom of the other side's list until you get recalled. It's in the TPA. Have you read it?




No, I don't work there. I have an interview soon, so I've been trying to keep up on these forums. Its hard not to commit, it seems like Xjt is getting attacked because ASA has there backs against the wall which was not caused b xjt. One guy is even mocking xjt for wanting contract improvements. Why is that a bad thing?

Originally Posted by Leroy Smith

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Originally Posted by freezingflyboy


I thought I said company shenanigans aside... I consider globalization to be shenanigans. That said, with the exception of last December when they screwed the pooch on the SmartPref awards, what I see just before the bid closes is what I've been awarded. Not saying that will ALWAYS be the case, just been my experience. YMMV.




Better be SURE that it is the case. The first few months after PBS was implemented, the awards were run at closing, one and done, and we had the awards that night. Since then, the awards are run and re-run to "optimize" the results. ALPA has some input on which solution is used, but if the company has any discretion, they can and will use it. I cant say that anything bad has come of this (nothing that our negotiated work rules wouldnt allow anyway), but beware of making assumptions of how the process will work based on how it is being used now. The thing about globalization that gives me pause, is that I dont see how it would be possible to lock down the process - that it allows too much leeway to the company to end run around seniority and possibly some of the other work rules.


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Originally Posted by RgrMurdock


I thought the system ran every 6 minutes or so. I thought what you see is what you get in regards to bidding as long as others above you don't change their bids.




It the system runs every 6 min, with the EXACT parameters used for the final run baked in, and the final run happens exactly at closing with no further shenanigans, then yes. If the parameters (especially the globalization) can be changed through multiple re-runs after closing, any preview is magic-8-ball at best.

Originally Posted by Bassman1985

What's the reserve callout on the ERJ side? Duty rig, trip rig?

Originally Posted by Nevets

Two hours short call and 12 hours long call. No rigs.

Originally Posted by Nevets

The facts are that there is polling taking place. There are two new negotiators that have training scheduled. There are two recall ballots open. Any ONE of those reasons is good enough to postpone any negotiations.

Get over it already. You didn't get your way again. And crying like a baby isn't going to make you get your way. Understand? Or do we need to draw pictures for you guys?

Originally Posted by Waitingformins

Originally Posted by Captain Tony

You have a lot of opinions for someone who doesn't even work here yet. I like your bravado. I hope you get assigned to the CRJ. Just don't share your thoughts on ASA at the interview.