New Envoy Information
12-04-2020, 08:58 AM
#6591
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2020
Posts: 459
I can see that you are totally not grounded in reality. Are you not aware that medical entities get money from the government for COVID deaths? Are you aware that most of the deaths are from elderly are those with multiple comorbidities? It's obvious that you are part of the scare crowd that thinks that government/people can actually control a virus. You can't stop it. And if it was bad, then I would agree with you. 99.77% of the total people who have gotten this that are otherwise healthy, HAVE RECOVERED! Guess you fail to recognize that.
Go put your mask back on and shelter in place at your home. If you truly work for Envoy, you have no leg to stand on in coming to work at all right now.
Go put your mask back on and shelter in place at your home. If you truly work for Envoy, you have no leg to stand on in coming to work at all right now.
Reality check, envoy is 6 months to maybe 2 years away from potentially closing its door OR prosperity, anything can happen in bankruptcy. The future of the flow is in great danger, but might be the least of anyone’s worries in the preceding year.
12-04-2020, 09:02 AM
#6592
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2019
Posts: 270
Again, I choose my faith in established science and academia, not you. If you have anything to add/dispute to anything I stated above, please feel free to post that. I won't get into an argument with you over "opinions from a lunatic". I do work for Envoy, so let's not try and go down that road. If by recovered you mean survived, OK, perhaps that is true, however, the point of my entire post was that you can't judge this solely on deaths, a point you failed to offer any counterpoint to. There are people that have and will die from Covid related complications down the road, numbers that haven't been counted. We also can speculate that there will be people who die younger due to complications or damage caused by Covid. This is all yet to be determined, so you coming off as some sage that knows the future is baffling, especially considering your previous predictions.
I have known two people who contracted it personally. One survived, one died. The one who died was older, but they actually didn't die from Covid and their death certificate doesn't list the cause as Covid. Guess what it does list? Pneumonia. Guess what caused that? You guessed it, Covid. All of this to say that there is a counterpoint to your argument about governments giving money for deaths and thus medical entities wanting to get extra money and that is, often Covid doesn't kill the person but rather the damage it causes or illnesses it brings on.
As for the one I know that recovered, they are still dealing with a lack of smell/taste and are certainly dealing with the "brain fog". Perhaps with all your downtime you should go and read facts, not what some talking head spews out on the radio or tv. I do go to work and no, I don't live in fear, however, I am also not so ignorant to dismiss this as some passing fad.
I will wait for your reply, one in which I can almost certainly expect no evidence to dismiss anything in my original post and one that is filled with more of your typical talking points.
I have known two people who contracted it personally. One survived, one died. The one who died was older, but they actually didn't die from Covid and their death certificate doesn't list the cause as Covid. Guess what it does list? Pneumonia. Guess what caused that? You guessed it, Covid. All of this to say that there is a counterpoint to your argument about governments giving money for deaths and thus medical entities wanting to get extra money and that is, often Covid doesn't kill the person but rather the damage it causes or illnesses it brings on.
As for the one I know that recovered, they are still dealing with a lack of smell/taste and are certainly dealing with the "brain fog". Perhaps with all your downtime you should go and read facts, not what some talking head spews out on the radio or tv. I do go to work and no, I don't live in fear, however, I am also not so ignorant to dismiss this as some passing fad.
I will wait for your reply, one in which I can almost certainly expect no evidence to dismiss anything in my original post and one that is filled with more of your typical talking points.
Check out the "science." The Philippines had one of the most aggressive lockdowns in the world. Sweden was at the other side of the lockdowns with basically, continue life as usual and protect those that are elderly or have conditions. The Philippines actually fared worse.
A Tale of Two Lockdowns: Sweden vs. the Philippines | RealClearMarkets
Maybe YOU should do a little more research before just basing it on a "coupla cases" that you personally encountered. THAT is not representative of anything except an emotional response. With your judgment here, you really shouldn't be flying planes. I might suggest returning to your former career.
12-04-2020, 10:12 AM
#6593
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2017
Posts: 3,791
The "science" is all over the place with this and nobody really knows. I already gave you a percentage straight from the CDC website that totals deaths with those who have no comorbidities or are not over age 70.
Check out the "science." The Philippines had one of the most aggressive lockdowns in the world. Sweden was at the other side of the lockdowns with basically, continue life as usual and protect those that are elderly or have conditions. The Philippines actually fared worse.
A Tale of Two Lockdowns: Sweden vs. the Philippines | RealClearMarkets
Maybe YOU should do a little more research before just basing it on a "coupla cases" that you personally encountered. THAT is not representative of anything except an emotional response. With your judgment here, you really shouldn't be flying planes. I might suggest returning to your former career.
Check out the "science." The Philippines had one of the most aggressive lockdowns in the world. Sweden was at the other side of the lockdowns with basically, continue life as usual and protect those that are elderly or have conditions. The Philippines actually fared worse.
A Tale of Two Lockdowns: Sweden vs. the Philippines | RealClearMarkets
Maybe YOU should do a little more research before just basing it on a "coupla cases" that you personally encountered. THAT is not representative of anything except an emotional response. With your judgment here, you really shouldn't be flying planes. I might suggest returning to your former career.
Secondly, I never said my experience with two people was representative of anything. I was simply pointing out that while there may be 1.5 million deaths directly attributed to Covid 19, there could be millions more that died to complications from or injury to other organs from Covid. I simply brought that up to show that I have first-hand experience with someone who contracted Covid, tested positive from it, recovered from Covid, and died from another condition all in the span of about 2.5 weeks, with their cause of death not mentioning Covid. The point being here is Covid can be the major contributor to another cause of death, thus skewing the numbers.
I also am not claiming to have all the answers but I think it is wildly irresponsible to label this thing as "mild" simply based on data that isn't even a year old. I also felt the point needed to be made that "death" numbers are the only thing we need to be looking at. Secondary symptoms and aliments can and most likely will cause a whole host of other issues as we move forward.
Lastly, all your positivity is simply hope and a prayer. You have constantly been wrong about Covid, the airlines handling of it as well as the recovery. I don't know why you are so confident given your track record. I will end with that, I don't see the point in wasting my time responding to you on this topic unless you offer something more concrete and less hyperbolic.
12-04-2020, 10:24 AM
#6594
Banned
Joined APC: Dec 2019
Posts: 270
OK, so now we are deflecting to a new topic instead of linking or citing anything relevant. Comparing Sweden and the Philippines is a pretty bold thing to do, given the vast population differences, not to mention the age of the citizens. Secondly, this is an economic website now knowing all the nuances of epidemiology. In addition, I never mentioned a lockdown in the post I was responding to yours. You called Covid 19 "mild" and I was offering a counterpoint to that. Covid 19 is too new for you to be making such definitive statements.
Secondly, I never said my experience with two people was representative of anything. I was simply pointing out that while there may be 1.5 million deaths directly attributed to Covid 19, there could be millions more that died to complications from or injury to other organs from Covid. I simply brought that up to show that I have first-hand experience with someone who contracted Covid, tested positive from it, recovered from Covid, and died from another condition all in the span of about 2.5 weeks, with their cause of death not mentioning Covid. The point being here is Covid can be the major contributor to another cause of death, thus skewing the numbers.
I also am not claiming to have all the answers but I think it is wildly irresponsible to label this thing as "mild" simply based on data that isn't even a year old. I also felt the point needed to be made that "death" numbers are the only thing we need to be looking at. Secondary symptoms and aliments can and most likely will cause a whole host of other issues as we move forward.
Lastly, all your positivity is simply hope and a prayer. You have constantly been wrong about Covid, the airlines handling of it as well as the recovery. I don't know why you are so confident given your track record. I will end with that, I don't see the point in wasting my time responding to you on this topic unless you offer something more concrete and less hyperbolic.
Secondly, I never said my experience with two people was representative of anything. I was simply pointing out that while there may be 1.5 million deaths directly attributed to Covid 19, there could be millions more that died to complications from or injury to other organs from Covid. I simply brought that up to show that I have first-hand experience with someone who contracted Covid, tested positive from it, recovered from Covid, and died from another condition all in the span of about 2.5 weeks, with their cause of death not mentioning Covid. The point being here is Covid can be the major contributor to another cause of death, thus skewing the numbers.
I also am not claiming to have all the answers but I think it is wildly irresponsible to label this thing as "mild" simply based on data that isn't even a year old. I also felt the point needed to be made that "death" numbers are the only thing we need to be looking at. Secondary symptoms and aliments can and most likely will cause a whole host of other issues as we move forward.
Lastly, all your positivity is simply hope and a prayer. You have constantly been wrong about Covid, the airlines handling of it as well as the recovery. I don't know why you are so confident given your track record. I will end with that, I don't see the point in wasting my time responding to you on this topic unless you offer something more concrete and less hyperbolic.
I've been in this business for many, many years. I was at Eagle during the Saab and ATR days and thus have firsthand knowledge of how much better Envoy is than it's predecessor. We truly are AMERICAN now. Optimism is good, you should try it. I also have the numbers and fact planning of American Airlines on my side as well.
12-04-2020, 10:28 AM
#6595
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2020
Position: AOG
Posts: 807
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com...b-d4d7546f4cdb
looks like bookings aren’t what AAG were hoping for and the losses will be around $30 million per day for the 4th quarter. With $14 billion in cash liquidity, how long does AAG ride it out before they make a trip to the District Court to file Chapter 11?
looks like bookings aren’t what AAG were hoping for and the losses will be around $30 million per day for the 4th quarter. With $14 billion in cash liquidity, how long does AAG ride it out before they make a trip to the District Court to file Chapter 11?
12-04-2020, 03:48 PM
#6596
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2017
Posts: 2,510
You are right. It's a waste of time to discuss anything with you here regarding the coronavirus. Your mind is already made up by what the hysterical media has sold you. As a last point I will say that I have several doctors and other medical personnel in my family thus I'm pulling from a vast well of knowledge.
I've been in this business for many, many years. I was at Eagle during the Saab and ATR days and thus have firsthand knowledge of how much better Envoy is than it's predecessor. We truly are AMERICAN now. Optimism is good, you should try it. I also have the numbers and fact planning of American Airlines on my side as well.
I've been in this business for many, many years. I was at Eagle during the Saab and ATR days and thus have firsthand knowledge of how much better Envoy is than it's predecessor. We truly are AMERICAN now. Optimism is good, you should try it. I also have the numbers and fact planning of American Airlines on my side as well.
12-04-2020, 04:05 PM
#6597
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Semi-Retired...
Posts: 3,260
email your rep. Check the ALPA app or ENY ALPA website. They’re pretty good about getting most things on there.
12-04-2020, 07:51 PM
#6598
Porco Rosso
Joined APC: Apr 2018
Posts: 2,522
https://americanairlines.gcs-web.com...b-d4d7546f4cdb
looks like bookings aren’t what AAG were hoping for and the losses will be around $30 million per day for the 4th quarter. With $14 billion in cash liquidity, how long does AAG ride it out before they make a trip to the District Court to file Chapter 11?
looks like bookings aren’t what AAG were hoping for and the losses will be around $30 million per day for the 4th quarter. With $14 billion in cash liquidity, how long does AAG ride it out before they make a trip to the District Court to file Chapter 11?
12-04-2020, 08:10 PM
#6599
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Oct 2017
Posts: 262
12-04-2020, 08:22 PM
#6600
Banned
Joined APC: Nov 2020
Posts: 459
I have a weird feeling that envoy will be the one to survive of the three, and be a feeder for whatever the hell American becomes. But BUCKLE UP, because the ride has just begun. I’ve lived through this story, it changes you, but doesn’t define you unless you let it.
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