More great news at Envoy!
09-25-2014, 12:41 PM
#415
Line Holder
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 31
Sure they would.
Again this explains why you all just don't get the big picture and why you all threw away the industry. There is value in wholly owned, they would never place all their flying with contact carriers. So your scenario holds no ground. Keep convincing yourself why you voted yes and sold your career for a few shiny jets.
You are crazy to think they won't put the flying at the lowest cost carrier that can reliably do the flying. And not only do the regional carrier pilot really have no say, the regional managements have little or no say.
And now you are seeing the regional flying overall SHRINKING and mainline flying INCREASING and CEOs stating that is their future intention. Sorry, but you are simply WRONG!
09-25-2014, 01:30 PM
#416
Line Holder
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Posts: 31
Why haven't we seen a NEW regional?
I've been around this industry for more than 15 years. I'm not the "oldest of timers" but I'm not a newbie either. I've seen close-hand Comair shutdown. I've seen the growth in the early 2000s and the stagnation... I've seen the "new" regional airlines...the true start ups...
So, here's a question for everyone to ponder -
IF the market is so good for the regionals (they can whipsaw, 12/4 pay caps, and lots of pilots around) [all of which are actually imho the last gasp of a dying segment of the industry]
and SINCE the market and Mainline at ALL TIME HIGHS for profit taking (stock market peaked at over 17000---highest ever; huge profits at the now consolidated Majors AND LCCs like Spirit and Allegiant are #2-3)
THEN - why no truly NEW startup regionals?
Why ONLY the whipsaw...
Just food for thought... Hey, if the mainlines really think they can low-ball forever...why aren't we seeing NEW carriers. Like the next-generation SkyWest with no union? Just wondering. Mainlines are upgrading their fleets, reducing debt, ... LCCs are growing rapidly to fill a void ... but the regional flying is shrinking. If the resources (pilots at low pay) are really there...why nothing truly new?
I have my thoughts...but I thought I'd throw it out there...just for fun!
Say I'm Richard Anderson or Parker...why not say, 100% of you will flow, we'll do it fast, you're the new (and only) pipeline, we'll make it only you, etc....
The closest we've really come is Endeavor and that, from what I understand, isn't working (at least the EtoD...)...
So, here's a question for everyone to ponder -
IF the market is so good for the regionals (they can whipsaw, 12/4 pay caps, and lots of pilots around) [all of which are actually imho the last gasp of a dying segment of the industry]
and SINCE the market and Mainline at ALL TIME HIGHS for profit taking (stock market peaked at over 17000---highest ever; huge profits at the now consolidated Majors AND LCCs like Spirit and Allegiant are #2-3)
THEN - why no truly NEW startup regionals?
Why ONLY the whipsaw...
Just food for thought... Hey, if the mainlines really think they can low-ball forever...why aren't we seeing NEW carriers. Like the next-generation SkyWest with no union? Just wondering. Mainlines are upgrading their fleets, reducing debt, ... LCCs are growing rapidly to fill a void ... but the regional flying is shrinking. If the resources (pilots at low pay) are really there...why nothing truly new?
I have my thoughts...but I thought I'd throw it out there...just for fun!
Say I'm Richard Anderson or Parker...why not say, 100% of you will flow, we'll do it fast, you're the new (and only) pipeline, we'll make it only you, etc....
The closest we've really come is Endeavor and that, from what I understand, isn't working (at least the EtoD...)...
09-25-2014, 06:15 PM
#417
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2011
Posts: 219
I've been around this industry for more than 15 years. I'm not the "oldest of timers" but I'm not a newbie either. I've seen close-hand Comair shutdown. I've seen the growth in the early 2000s and the stagnation... I've seen the "new" regional airlines...the true start ups...
So, here's a question for everyone to ponder -
IF the market is so good for the regionals (they can whipsaw, 12/4 pay caps, and lots of pilots around) [all of which are actually imho the last gasp of a dying segment of the industry]
and SINCE the market and Mainline at ALL TIME HIGHS for profit taking (stock market peaked at over 17000---highest ever; huge profits at the now consolidated Majors AND LCCs like Spirit and Allegiant are #2-3)
THEN - why no truly NEW startup regionals?
Why ONLY the whipsaw...
Just food for thought... Hey, if the mainlines really think they can low-ball forever...why aren't we seeing NEW carriers. Like the next-generation SkyWest with no union? Just wondering. Mainlines are upgrading their fleets, reducing debt, ... LCCs are growing rapidly to fill a void ... but the regional flying is shrinking. If the resources (pilots at low pay) are really there...why nothing truly new?
I have my thoughts...but I thought I'd throw it out there...just for fun!
Say I'm Richard Anderson or Parker...why not say, 100% of you will flow, we'll do it fast, you're the new (and only) pipeline, we'll make it only you, etc....
The closest we've really come is Endeavor and that, from what I understand, isn't working (at least the EtoD...)...
So, here's a question for everyone to ponder -
IF the market is so good for the regionals (they can whipsaw, 12/4 pay caps, and lots of pilots around) [all of which are actually imho the last gasp of a dying segment of the industry]
and SINCE the market and Mainline at ALL TIME HIGHS for profit taking (stock market peaked at over 17000---highest ever; huge profits at the now consolidated Majors AND LCCs like Spirit and Allegiant are #2-3)
THEN - why no truly NEW startup regionals?
Why ONLY the whipsaw...
Just food for thought... Hey, if the mainlines really think they can low-ball forever...why aren't we seeing NEW carriers. Like the next-generation SkyWest with no union? Just wondering. Mainlines are upgrading their fleets, reducing debt, ... LCCs are growing rapidly to fill a void ... but the regional flying is shrinking. If the resources (pilots at low pay) are really there...why nothing truly new?
I have my thoughts...but I thought I'd throw it out there...just for fun!
Say I'm Richard Anderson or Parker...why not say, 100% of you will flow, we'll do it fast, you're the new (and only) pipeline, we'll make it only you, etc....
The closest we've really come is Endeavor and that, from what I understand, isn't working (at least the EtoD...)...
Oh that's right. Scott Krby just told the APA pilots at the ORD meeting they will offer delta rates + 3% but they want scope relief (89 seats for regionals) in return
09-25-2014, 06:20 PM
#418
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Position: forever fo
Posts: 2,413
Better question , if nobody is going to be at the regionals in 8 years, why is the 12/4 payscale so non negotiable?
Oh that's right. Scott Krby just told the APA pilots at the ORD meeting they will offer delta rates + 3% but they want scope relief (89 seats for regionals) in return
Oh that's right. Scott Krby just told the APA pilots at the ORD meeting they will offer delta rates + 3% but they want scope relief (89 seats for regionals) in return
09-25-2014, 06:30 PM
#419
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2013
Posts: 3,014
It's more likely that the regionals will become the new majors. They already know regional pilots will do anything so there is no incentive to do you any favors at the majors either. Life will be changing there as well as the current crop of regionals start to move over. I don't see today's regional pilots making the kind of money at the majors that todays major pilots make.
09-25-2014, 06:52 PM
#420
Day puke
Joined APC: Feb 2006
Position: Out.
Posts: 3,865
I've been around this industry for more than 15 years. I'm not the "oldest of timers" but I'm not a newbie either. I've seen close-hand Comair shutdown. I've seen the growth in the early 2000s and the stagnation... I've seen the "new" regional airlines...the true start ups...
So, here's a question for everyone to ponder -
IF the market is so good for the regionals (they can whipsaw, 12/4 pay caps, and lots of pilots around) [all of which are actually imho the last gasp of a dying segment of the industry]
and SINCE the market and Mainline at ALL TIME HIGHS for profit taking (stock market peaked at over 17000---highest ever; huge profits at the now consolidated Majors AND LCCs like Spirit and Allegiant are #2-3)
THEN - why no truly NEW startup regionals?
Why ONLY the whipsaw...
Just food for thought... Hey, if the mainlines really think they can low-ball forever...why aren't we seeing NEW carriers. Like the next-generation SkyWest with no union? Just wondering. Mainlines are upgrading their fleets, reducing debt, ... LCCs are growing rapidly to fill a void ... but the regional flying is shrinking. If the resources (pilots at low pay) are really there...why nothing truly new?
I have my thoughts...but I thought I'd throw it out there...just for fun!
Say I'm Richard Anderson or Parker...why not say, 100% of you will flow, we'll do it fast, you're the new (and only) pipeline, we'll make it only you, etc....
The closest we've really come is Endeavor and that, from what I understand, isn't working (at least the EtoD...)...
So, here's a question for everyone to ponder -
IF the market is so good for the regionals (they can whipsaw, 12/4 pay caps, and lots of pilots around) [all of which are actually imho the last gasp of a dying segment of the industry]
and SINCE the market and Mainline at ALL TIME HIGHS for profit taking (stock market peaked at over 17000---highest ever; huge profits at the now consolidated Majors AND LCCs like Spirit and Allegiant are #2-3)
THEN - why no truly NEW startup regionals?
Why ONLY the whipsaw...
Just food for thought... Hey, if the mainlines really think they can low-ball forever...why aren't we seeing NEW carriers. Like the next-generation SkyWest with no union? Just wondering. Mainlines are upgrading their fleets, reducing debt, ... LCCs are growing rapidly to fill a void ... but the regional flying is shrinking. If the resources (pilots at low pay) are really there...why nothing truly new?
I have my thoughts...but I thought I'd throw it out there...just for fun!
Say I'm Richard Anderson or Parker...why not say, 100% of you will flow, we'll do it fast, you're the new (and only) pipeline, we'll make it only you, etc....
The closest we've really come is Endeavor and that, from what I understand, isn't working (at least the EtoD...)...
But right now, nobody is sure what the "regional" airline of the future will look like. Time to hunker down, pay a couple percent more for an established carrier, and find out what is going to happen.
Heck, there are airports that are running operations at 100 percent: there can be only so many departures from a given runway. For example, JFK and LGA are pretty close to being maxed out. The odds of building a new airport in NYC are nil. So, if more pax are to be serviced, they must be in larger aircraft. The death of (or at least the limiting) of regionals may end up being airport capacity.
Or to put it another way, why are there articulated buses? Because either the roadway won't accommodate two buses or it is cheaper to run one big bus, even if the driver is paid more, than running two buses.
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