More great news at Envoy!
09-22-2014, 06:02 AM
#374
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Apr 2008
Posts: 255
You couldn't be more wrong... its a war on scope and future jobs at the majors. Educate yourself or doom yourself to eternal regional hell.
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/american-us-airways-merger/84069-scope.html
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/am...t-sharing.html
(thanks griff for the links and quote)
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/american-us-airways-merger/84069-scope.html
http://www.airlinepilotforums.com/am...t-sharing.html
Basically, their negotiating committee is going after DAL rates, and Kirby is countering with trading away scope for better pay rates.
This sh!t ****ed the the eff off!!! This is exactly what I (and many others) have predicted in numerous threads in here before. (Look them up, if you want). This crap isn't about being "cost effective", or "competing against Delta's regional pay rates". The few bucks an hour more that we make over Pinnacle, PSA, or PDT doesn't add up to enough for a multi billion dollar profitable company to be concerned with. It has all to do with Parker, Kirby, and the gang to drive the cost disparity so large between regionals and mainline that it gives them enough ammo to attack mainline scope next. They will threaten that MOU rate in exchange for E190's to the regionals. Then, what's next, MD80's? 737's? All group 2 aircraft? If that happens, you can kiss flow goodbye. There will be nothing to flow to. You'll be flying E190's, MD80's, 737's, and A320's at the regionals for E145 rates... And all the SJS kids over at you know where, will be all to happy to settle for retiring off of that, having never made Over 6 figures in one year in their whole f()cking lives....
This sh!t ****ed the the eff off!!! This is exactly what I (and many others) have predicted in numerous threads in here before. (Look them up, if you want). This crap isn't about being "cost effective", or "competing against Delta's regional pay rates". The few bucks an hour more that we make over Pinnacle, PSA, or PDT doesn't add up to enough for a multi billion dollar profitable company to be concerned with. It has all to do with Parker, Kirby, and the gang to drive the cost disparity so large between regionals and mainline that it gives them enough ammo to attack mainline scope next. They will threaten that MOU rate in exchange for E190's to the regionals. Then, what's next, MD80's? 737's? All group 2 aircraft? If that happens, you can kiss flow goodbye. There will be nothing to flow to. You'll be flying E190's, MD80's, 737's, and A320's at the regionals for E145 rates... And all the SJS kids over at you know where, will be all to happy to settle for retiring off of that, having never made Over 6 figures in one year in their whole f()cking lives....
09-22-2014, 06:15 AM
#375
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2005
Posts: 3,707
Well the problem is the feeders cannot match the reset this January at delta. Parker is trying to get this done before DAL reset comes out as a failure. This way Parker has a permanent reset at AAG. What is delta going to do when there feeders cannot meet the reset to endeavor rates, cancel there contracts.
No one has had to match the reset at delta yet and everyone wants to concede the fight up front before all the info and players show up to the game.
2015 will be an interesting year.
No one has had to match the reset at delta yet and everyone wants to concede the fight up front before all the info and players show up to the game.
2015 will be an interesting year.
09-22-2014, 07:01 AM
#376
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Aug 2008
Posts: 545
Which version of him is right? Just last month he went on record and agreed with Lee Moak that there is NO pilot shortage:
American Airlines and Envoy Pilots Try Again on Contract Talks - TheStreet
Last week, American Eagle pilots staged a demonstration at New York LaGuardia Airport, The goal “was to inform the public and government officials (that) the 'pilot shortage' is a pay shortage, not a pilot shortage,” said Ray Igou, captain representative to the union’s New York local.
Now he decides to shift gears and side with the RAA-of all organizations-and of all people: Roger freakin' Cohen who's only goal is to repeal the 1500 hour rule, and to do so is trying to convince congress that it is creating a pilot shortage that doesn't exist.
Remember that Roger Cohen is the same guy who went on National television and claimed airline pilots "only work" on average 20 hours a week so therefore shouldn't complain about low pay. Now Cujo/Ray/Mason is using him as his source????
Here is a little taste of Roger Cohen:
But then again, this is a job that most pilots are working 70, 75, 80 hours per month as opposed to a 40-hour work weeks that most Americans do.
He said this on a Nationally televised interview regarding low pilot pay...about a year after the Colgan disaster.
American Airlines and Envoy Pilots Try Again on Contract Talks - TheStreet
Last week, American Eagle pilots staged a demonstration at New York LaGuardia Airport, The goal “was to inform the public and government officials (that) the 'pilot shortage' is a pay shortage, not a pilot shortage,” said Ray Igou, captain representative to the union’s New York local.
Now he decides to shift gears and side with the RAA-of all organizations-and of all people: Roger freakin' Cohen who's only goal is to repeal the 1500 hour rule, and to do so is trying to convince congress that it is creating a pilot shortage that doesn't exist.
Remember that Roger Cohen is the same guy who went on National television and claimed airline pilots "only work" on average 20 hours a week so therefore shouldn't complain about low pay. Now Cujo/Ray/Mason is using him as his source????
Here is a little taste of Roger Cohen:
But then again, this is a job that most pilots are working 70, 75, 80 hours per month as opposed to a 40-hour work weeks that most Americans do.
He said this on a Nationally televised interview regarding low pilot pay...about a year after the Colgan disaster.
09-22-2014, 08:11 AM
#377
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Feb 2014
Position: Semi-Retired...
Posts: 3,236
Which version of him is right? Just last month he went on record and agreed with Lee Moak that there is NO pilot shortage:
American Airlines and Envoy Pilots Try Again on Contract Talks - TheStreet
Last week, American Eagle pilots staged a demonstration at New York LaGuardia Airport, The goal “was to inform the public and government officials (that) the 'pilot shortage' is a pay shortage, not a pilot shortage,” said Ray Igou, captain representative to the union’s New York local.
Now he decides to shift gears and side with the RAA-of all organizations-and of all people: Roger freakin' Cohen who's only goal is to repeal the 1500 hour rule, and to do so is trying to convince congress that it is creating a pilot shortage that doesn't exist.
.
American Airlines and Envoy Pilots Try Again on Contract Talks - TheStreet
Last week, American Eagle pilots staged a demonstration at New York LaGuardia Airport, The goal “was to inform the public and government officials (that) the 'pilot shortage' is a pay shortage, not a pilot shortage,” said Ray Igou, captain representative to the union’s New York local.
Now he decides to shift gears and side with the RAA-of all organizations-and of all people: Roger freakin' Cohen who's only goal is to repeal the 1500 hour rule, and to do so is trying to convince congress that it is creating a pilot shortage that doesn't exist.
.
The current pilot shortage is due to a pay shortage. There is no shortage of available pilots to fill these jobs currently. There is a shortage of pilots willing to do it for the wages and work rules currently being offered.
There is no conflict between the two messages; they are the same message expressed in different ways.
Not siding with Cohen at all. Using the RAA's own words against them to show there IS a shortage, they know it, and are trying everything to mittigate the shortage including weakening legislation.
09-22-2014, 09:36 AM
#379
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Mar 2014
Posts: 3,238
If there was no 1500 hour rule there would be plenty of guys filling seats. The ATP thing, which I agree with, certainly put a limit on the supply. Similar to what other industries have done, and if ALPA had their stuff together they would limit seats at flight schools like the AMA does for med schools. Unfortunately they don't have that ability, but if they did you'd see f/os on RJs making respectable money.
The companies that are staffing now only can do so because of the promise of short upgrades. At the tail end of their delivery schedule you'll see them have the same issues.
The companies that are staffing now only can do so because of the promise of short upgrades. At the tail end of their delivery schedule you'll see them have the same issues.
09-22-2014, 09:38 AM
#380
Line Holder
Joined APC: Aug 2012
Posts: 49
Which version of him is right? Just last month he went on record and agreed with Lee Moak that there is NO pilot shortage:
American Airlines and Envoy Pilots Try Again on Contract Talks - TheStreet
Last week, American Eagle pilots staged a demonstration at New York LaGuardia Airport, The goal “was to inform the public and government officials (that) the 'pilot shortage' is a pay shortage, not a pilot shortage,” said Ray Igou, captain representative to the union’s New York local.
Now he decides to shift gears and side with the RAA-of all organizations-and of all people: Roger freakin' Cohen who's only goal is to repeal the 1500 hour rule, and to do so is trying to convince congress that it is creating a pilot shortage that doesn't exist.
Remember that Roger Cohen is the same guy who went on National television and claimed airline pilots "only work" on average 20 hours a week so therefore shouldn't complain about low pay. Now Cujo/Ray/Mason is using him as his source????
Here is a little taste of Roger Cohen:
But then again, this is a job that most pilots are working 70, 75, 80 hours per month as opposed to a 40-hour work weeks that most Americans do.
He said this on a Nationally televised interview regarding low pilot pay...about a year after the Colgan disaster.
American Airlines and Envoy Pilots Try Again on Contract Talks - TheStreet
Last week, American Eagle pilots staged a demonstration at New York LaGuardia Airport, The goal “was to inform the public and government officials (that) the 'pilot shortage' is a pay shortage, not a pilot shortage,” said Ray Igou, captain representative to the union’s New York local.
Now he decides to shift gears and side with the RAA-of all organizations-and of all people: Roger freakin' Cohen who's only goal is to repeal the 1500 hour rule, and to do so is trying to convince congress that it is creating a pilot shortage that doesn't exist.
Remember that Roger Cohen is the same guy who went on National television and claimed airline pilots "only work" on average 20 hours a week so therefore shouldn't complain about low pay. Now Cujo/Ray/Mason is using him as his source????
Here is a little taste of Roger Cohen:
But then again, this is a job that most pilots are working 70, 75, 80 hours per month as opposed to a 40-hour work weeks that most Americans do.
He said this on a Nationally televised interview regarding low pilot pay...about a year after the Colgan disaster.
He probably has a job with team Tony and the RAA already lined up.
In his resume he has "Easily convinced 70% pilots about a pilot shortage, able to place CRJ700 at a lower rate at PSA. Continuously working to close American Eagle (envoy) so he can punish the pilots that disagree with him at all and any public and private internet forum"
People, RAA has the next Roger Cohen!
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