Any "Latest & Greatest" about Endeavor?
06-15-2016, 05:45 PM
#5221
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Posts: 787
Brett I am very happy for you, your recent upgrade, and those friends of mine who are happy working at 9E. I hope you all the best.
I am not happy to see how your recruiters and lifers have advocated for new hires to fill in the bottom of the seniority list. I feel they are being selfish and dishonest. I was provoked to post my opinons and ask my questions when I continued to see 9E recruiters posting in other airlines forums.
How many 9E pilots have failed the guaranteed interview and will not be leaving? What happens when the C Series takes back the Delta flying? What happens when the temporary bonuses expire?
I am not happy to see how your recruiters and lifers have advocated for new hires to fill in the bottom of the seniority list. I feel they are being selfish and dishonest. I was provoked to post my opinons and ask my questions when I continued to see 9E recruiters posting in other airlines forums.
How many 9E pilots have failed the guaranteed interview and will not be leaving? What happens when the C Series takes back the Delta flying? What happens when the temporary bonuses expire?
Regardless of what any "lifer" posted in a forum, your vendetta against the company and need for retaliation for a post on a message board, by someone you claim is a recruiter is childish at best. I know there aren't any recruiters who are authorized to act in any capacity on this or any other board.
I apologize if one of our overzealous pilots wanders into a PSA thread and tries to derail it. It's a message board - unfortunately anonymity will breed this type of behavior. Let's just all go back to our corners and try to get out of this cesspool regional world.
As far as your questions- there have been around 200 pilots turned down via the SSP. Many pilots have not attempted. We are losing on average 5 captains per month to employers other than Delta.
The CSeries are largely for 50-seat replacement as well as 70-seat retirements, not to mention domestic capacity increases. That's not to say that Endeavor won't lose flying as a result, but the Bankruptcy agreement does guarantee 81 -900s until 2021. A similar setup to PSA, no?
The company has approached the union about extending the retention bonuses, but the Association has chosen to defer those negotiations in hopes we can retrieve that cash in meaningful contract repair. We will see.
06-15-2016, 05:49 PM
#5223
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2014
Posts: 193
LOL!! An ex-9E guy who jumped ship now trying to justify his decision to go to bottom feeding PSA.... You can't pay for this good of entertainment, folks!
9E pilots move on to all other airlines, just like every other carrier. Just because someone failed or didn't take the Delta interview doesn't mean they are unhirable. We just have the added bonus of hundreds of pilots going to Delta on top of normal attrition.
Both the company and union have agreed that they will be extending the bonus, there is just a disagreement in how that will take place. The union wants it rolled into the pay scale while the company wants it still as a bonus. It will not cease to exist after 2018....
Delta has stated publicly many times that Endeavor plays a crucial role in the system and will continue to in the future. Heck, even Delta's planned ab initio program involves 9E. Ed has talked that he wants to continue to grow 9E.... Why wouldn't they? We are cheaper than mainline but are consistent and well run. We cover other DCI carrier flights on the daily. Endeavor, IMHO, is the safest DCI carrier as it stands now.
Also, how many times does it have to be said that the bonus is CONTRACTUAL. It cannot be taken away any easier than PSA could decide to pay you $1 an hour...
All your tired, old rhetoric has been heard a million times by other sour ex 9E guys (eyy AlaskaBound!). Guess what? Every doomsday prediction that has been made about 9E never came true, in fact 9E has flourished! That must drive you mad, huh? Everyone said the bonus would never be paid out, that 9E would be shut down in a month, etc. Last I checked our doors are open and the checks aren't bouncing.
Signed,
A first year FO who will gross over $70k this year (which is probably better than a PSA captain will get paid... Drives you mad, huh?)
9E pilots move on to all other airlines, just like every other carrier. Just because someone failed or didn't take the Delta interview doesn't mean they are unhirable. We just have the added bonus of hundreds of pilots going to Delta on top of normal attrition.
Both the company and union have agreed that they will be extending the bonus, there is just a disagreement in how that will take place. The union wants it rolled into the pay scale while the company wants it still as a bonus. It will not cease to exist after 2018....
Delta has stated publicly many times that Endeavor plays a crucial role in the system and will continue to in the future. Heck, even Delta's planned ab initio program involves 9E. Ed has talked that he wants to continue to grow 9E.... Why wouldn't they? We are cheaper than mainline but are consistent and well run. We cover other DCI carrier flights on the daily. Endeavor, IMHO, is the safest DCI carrier as it stands now.
Also, how many times does it have to be said that the bonus is CONTRACTUAL. It cannot be taken away any easier than PSA could decide to pay you $1 an hour...
All your tired, old rhetoric has been heard a million times by other sour ex 9E guys (eyy AlaskaBound!). Guess what? Every doomsday prediction that has been made about 9E never came true, in fact 9E has flourished! That must drive you mad, huh? Everyone said the bonus would never be paid out, that 9E would be shut down in a month, etc. Last I checked our doors are open and the checks aren't bouncing.
Signed,
A first year FO who will gross over $70k this year (which is probably better than a PSA captain will get paid... Drives you mad, huh?)
06-15-2016, 05:51 PM
#5224
Line Holder
Joined APC: Jul 2008
Position: CA
Posts: 94
To the second, I'm sure it will effect some.
Gripe at the guys who made regionals have a great living wage at the top and made it where the senior guys don't want to leave.
I heard your excuse on why you are trashing on our thread, but why not go poop in your yard. From the message your MEC Chair put out today your new hires are going to take a pay cut for year two. Our bonuses aren't going away. or something way better will come up. IMO.
06-15-2016, 06:02 PM
#5225
Living the Dream
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Position: Another RJ CA
Posts: 90
Don't know who you are, but you know me, so I will give you the benefit of the doubt and just say you are having a bad day.
Regardless of what any "lifer" posted in a forum, your vendetta against the company and need for retaliation for a post on a message board, by someone you claim is a recruiter is childish at best. I know there aren't any recruiters who are authorized to act in any capacity on this or any other board.
I apologize if one of our overzealous pilots wanders into a PSA thread and tries to derail it. It's a message board - unfortunately anonymity will breed this type of behavior. Let's just all go back to our corners and try to get out of this cesspool regional world.
As far as your questions- there have been around 200 pilots turned down via the SSP. Many pilots have not attempted. We are losing on average 5 captains per month to employers other than Delta.
The CSeries are largely for 50-seat replacement as well as 70-seat retirements, not to mention domestic capacity increases. That's not to say that Endeavor won't lose flying as a result, but the Bankruptcy agreement does guarantee 81 -900s until 2021. A similar setup to PSA, no?
The company has approached the union about extending the retention bonuses, but the Association has chosen to defer those negotiations in hopes we can retrieve that cash in meaningful contract repair. We will see.
Regardless of what any "lifer" posted in a forum, your vendetta against the company and need for retaliation for a post on a message board, by someone you claim is a recruiter is childish at best. I know there aren't any recruiters who are authorized to act in any capacity on this or any other board.
I apologize if one of our overzealous pilots wanders into a PSA thread and tries to derail it. It's a message board - unfortunately anonymity will breed this type of behavior. Let's just all go back to our corners and try to get out of this cesspool regional world.
As far as your questions- there have been around 200 pilots turned down via the SSP. Many pilots have not attempted. We are losing on average 5 captains per month to employers other than Delta.
The CSeries are largely for 50-seat replacement as well as 70-seat retirements, not to mention domestic capacity increases. That's not to say that Endeavor won't lose flying as a result, but the Bankruptcy agreement does guarantee 81 -900s until 2021. A similar setup to PSA, no?
The company has approached the union about extending the retention bonuses, but the Association has chosen to defer those negotiations in hopes we can retrieve that cash in meaningful contract repair. We will see.
06-15-2016, 06:03 PM
#5226
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Sep 2010
Posts: 2,648
A little jaded, are we? Again, which regional isn't trying to paint the best picture for recruiting purposes? Also are you suggesting none of them bend the truth either? No one has a crystal ball, and even with the best intentions things could be drastically different years down the road. Aviation business models are pretty fluid.
06-15-2016, 06:07 PM
#5227
Living the Dream
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Position: Another RJ CA
Posts: 90
I don't know... to any of your questions. The first is a ver closely guarded secret.
To the second, I'm sure it will effect some.
Gripe at the guys who made regionals have a great living wage at the top and made it where the senior guys don't want to leave.
I heard your excuse on why you are trashing on our thread, but why not go poop in your yard. From the message your MEC Chair put out today your new hires are going to take a pay cut for year two. Our bonuses aren't going away. or something way better will come up. IMO.
To the second, I'm sure it will effect some.
Gripe at the guys who made regionals have a great living wage at the top and made it where the senior guys don't want to leave.
I heard your excuse on why you are trashing on our thread, but why not go poop in your yard. From the message your MEC Chair put out today your new hires are going to take a pay cut for year two. Our bonuses aren't going away. or something way better will come up. IMO.
06-15-2016, 06:10 PM
#5228
Living the Dream
Joined APC: Feb 2011
Position: Another RJ CA
Posts: 90
A little jaded, are we? Again, which regional isn't trying to paint the best picture for recruiting purposes? Also are you suggesting none of them bend the truth either? No one has a crystal ball, and even with the best intentions things could be drastically different years down the road. Aviation business models are pretty fluid.
06-15-2016, 06:42 PM
#5229
Gets Weekends Off
Joined APC: Jan 2011
Posts: 843
Looks like I made him mad by stating some truth. Don't be angry that you left 9e for a bottom feeder that steals flying by voting in a poor contract. You can come on back to 9e. I'll split the referral bonus with you. We have a 1yr upgrade. Come on back.
06-15-2016, 06:45 PM
#5230
Line Holder
Joined APC: Mar 2015
Posts: 26
Many things that I have confided in private to others has happened, and several things that are happening future that I am privy to, which I will touch on some briefly. It is sad however to see those who wish the downfall of Endeavor, and cannot appreciate the turnaround of the company. A few of the well known naysayers have been silent, and I believe it is their way of acknowledging the change and the positive trajectory of Endeavor.
Yes, upgrade times have dropped drastically at Endeavor and will continue to remain low based on the long term plans that Delta has. Upgrades moving forward will be about 1.5 years and the immediate need for street captains will be apparent to the public soon.
The retention bonus expiry date was deliberate but not for the apparent reasons to the masses. The retention bonus is set to expire around the same time the pilot contract expires. It is labeled a retention bonus and not a hourly increase as that would also trigger a corresponding increases (me too clauses) for all other staff. The C-Series order has absolutely NOTHING to do with the retention bonus expiration.
Delta's plan is in FACT to take back ALL regional flying, but what many fail to understand is how and why. Endeavor is the vehicle in which this will be accomplished. The plan to replace the Shuttle America flying was in place long before Republic's bankruptcy (Delta's suit was the shot across the bow) and it just facilitated Delta's plan. From the Bankrupcy they were able to get out of the 145 contract, get the C-Series slots, as well as slots at a few of the airports Republic serves.
As Endeavor can staff it new bases will open, including ATL. More of the Delta flying will shift from current DCI carriers to Delta's Endevor Division - IN HOUSE. Endeavor may seem like a DCI carrier, but what most don't realize is Endeavor does not report to or is controlled in any shape size or form by DCI management unlike Skywest, Republic, ExpressJet, Gojet or Compass.
The end game is to have Endevor take over all the sub-contracted flying, why? Because Delta has realized that they can control the reliability and product with a high level of operational effecency that brings the better yields than contractors. Most of Endeavors operation that would either over lap or duplicated in Atlanta have been moved to Atlanta. Contractors however have to be payed to cover all the operations associated cost and staffing plus what should be a healthy profit but are unable to give the same results that Endevor has been giving them at a cheaper total cost.
Back to the C-Series and Delta taking back all the flying with it, regional flying is a misnomer, as the CRJ900's typical stage length is far from operating in a "region" it does a lot of same flying of the MD88/B717 but on thinner routes. The C-Series will be doing some of the heavier flying the the 900's can't manage effectively and replace the MD's. The current CRJ200's are place holders as those will be eventually replaced with 700/900's.
Now to tie it all up in a bow, the end game will be to fold Endevor into Delta, not a pipe dream but the long term goal, move away from reliance in contractors that they are unable to control the reliability and product and operate all the aircraft they own - why give a company an aircraft to operate and pay all this money to but don't have the reliability? Yes the Regional experiment has failed and this is the exit strategy.
So there you have it where this is all going, in a few years it shall come to pass as the regional game IS changing. Oh, and the whole SSP/EtD/DGI programs, what you fail to realize is Delta had showed their hand with having all Delta Pilots move thru endeavor with the EtD program, however that Failed for a few reasons which I won't get into now, the plans for the current pilots, new pilots and the failed SSP pilots is fairly meticulous and complicated. But I will say it is actively being worked on and will yield an overall positive result.
Say what you wish, get crazy in your comments but it is a great time to be a pilot where ever you may be, some mainline management might be more nimble than others in some areas but the over all out come is our profession will have risen from the ashes of years past, be happy not bitter and look forward to the future!
Razor
Yes, upgrade times have dropped drastically at Endeavor and will continue to remain low based on the long term plans that Delta has. Upgrades moving forward will be about 1.5 years and the immediate need for street captains will be apparent to the public soon.
The retention bonus expiry date was deliberate but not for the apparent reasons to the masses. The retention bonus is set to expire around the same time the pilot contract expires. It is labeled a retention bonus and not a hourly increase as that would also trigger a corresponding increases (me too clauses) for all other staff. The C-Series order has absolutely NOTHING to do with the retention bonus expiration.
Delta's plan is in FACT to take back ALL regional flying, but what many fail to understand is how and why. Endeavor is the vehicle in which this will be accomplished. The plan to replace the Shuttle America flying was in place long before Republic's bankruptcy (Delta's suit was the shot across the bow) and it just facilitated Delta's plan. From the Bankrupcy they were able to get out of the 145 contract, get the C-Series slots, as well as slots at a few of the airports Republic serves.
As Endeavor can staff it new bases will open, including ATL. More of the Delta flying will shift from current DCI carriers to Delta's Endevor Division - IN HOUSE. Endeavor may seem like a DCI carrier, but what most don't realize is Endeavor does not report to or is controlled in any shape size or form by DCI management unlike Skywest, Republic, ExpressJet, Gojet or Compass.
The end game is to have Endevor take over all the sub-contracted flying, why? Because Delta has realized that they can control the reliability and product with a high level of operational effecency that brings the better yields than contractors. Most of Endeavors operation that would either over lap or duplicated in Atlanta have been moved to Atlanta. Contractors however have to be payed to cover all the operations associated cost and staffing plus what should be a healthy profit but are unable to give the same results that Endevor has been giving them at a cheaper total cost.
Back to the C-Series and Delta taking back all the flying with it, regional flying is a misnomer, as the CRJ900's typical stage length is far from operating in a "region" it does a lot of same flying of the MD88/B717 but on thinner routes. The C-Series will be doing some of the heavier flying the the 900's can't manage effectively and replace the MD's. The current CRJ200's are place holders as those will be eventually replaced with 700/900's.
Now to tie it all up in a bow, the end game will be to fold Endevor into Delta, not a pipe dream but the long term goal, move away from reliance in contractors that they are unable to control the reliability and product and operate all the aircraft they own - why give a company an aircraft to operate and pay all this money to but don't have the reliability? Yes the Regional experiment has failed and this is the exit strategy.
So there you have it where this is all going, in a few years it shall come to pass as the regional game IS changing. Oh, and the whole SSP/EtD/DGI programs, what you fail to realize is Delta had showed their hand with having all Delta Pilots move thru endeavor with the EtD program, however that Failed for a few reasons which I won't get into now, the plans for the current pilots, new pilots and the failed SSP pilots is fairly meticulous and complicated. But I will say it is actively being worked on and will yield an overall positive result.
Say what you wish, get crazy in your comments but it is a great time to be a pilot where ever you may be, some mainline management might be more nimble than others in some areas but the over all out come is our profession will have risen from the ashes of years past, be happy not bitter and look forward to the future!
Razor
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